00:00I knew him in school, and now I know him on the radio.
00:02He's on the Wise Heart Right, We Make It Right, called Kyle Wright Hotline.
00:05Ladies and gentlemen, Greg Schwartz.
00:06He is from Bleach Report.
00:07He is an NBA writer.
00:09He is the one lone dissenting voice when it came to James Harden.
00:14He knows his basketball.
00:16He joins us right now.
00:17Greg, good morning.
00:18Good morning.
00:19Thanks for having me on today.
00:20All right, where's LeBron going to go?
00:24We're just getting right to it.
00:25We got to.
00:26We just got to get right down to the nitty-gritty.
00:30The question we should be asking is, do the Cavs need LeBron James when we have Malik Thomas?
00:36That's a great point.
00:3728 a game.
00:38There it is, boy.
00:40There it is.
00:42If you follow the betting markets and all that, Cleveland's been in the lead for weeks, right?
00:49And obviously the excitement, at least for me and I think for most of us, was probably a little bit
00:56higher than it was a couple weeks ago when we were watching this.
00:58And now it's like, all right, you know, let's kind of make our decision here.
01:02And I think that there's probably a lot of guys in the league, James Harden, DeMar DeRozan, Jonathan Kaminga.
01:08They're kind of like, hey, we need you to make your decision, LeBron, because that's going to affect our future
01:13and our salaries and our teams as well.
01:15So, I mean, look, at the end of the day, I still think it's Cleveland.
01:19They are the favorites.
01:21It makes all the sense in the world to come back to the Eastern Conference.
01:24The East is better.
01:25Yes, it's getting slowly better.
01:27The West is still the West.
01:29And no matter where he signs in the West, unless it's with San Antonio or if it's with Oklahoma City,
01:34he's probably not going to get to the finals.
01:36The East is your best path back to the finals.
01:39Obviously, we know all the advantages to come with signing with the Cavaliers.
01:43The Philadelphia 76ers are a team ever since they traded for Jalen Brown that I've kind of moved to the
01:48top of my potential list.
01:50Miami's still lingering.
01:51I just, from a roster fit, I just don't see it that they don't have enough shooting on that team.
01:58So, I still think at the end of the day, it's Cleveland unless another team makes a move that would
02:02vault them to number one.
02:04Well, it's interesting, Greg, the way that people have talked about this.
02:08And I understand the excitement if you're a national reporter to want to see Steph Curry and LeBron unite this
02:15late in their careers,
02:16but both still with so much talent still.
02:19We saw when these guys are healthy, they're both able to play, and we've seen them on Team USA.
02:24But I don't understand those same people acting like LeBron couldn't fit in anywhere.
02:29He's literally the smartest basketball player I've ever seen.
02:33And in the playoffs last year, you saw how he could morph from going from the third option in L
02:40.A.
02:40to, oh, now I have to be the first option.
02:41I can still do that at this age.
02:44And he took care of the Houston Rockets.
02:45Like, that to me, yeah, you want a good basketball fit, but did anybody really think Carl Anthony Towns,
02:51a team with him at center and Jalen Brunson and then Josh Hart in a starting five was ever going
02:58to be a perfect basketball fit?
02:59And they just won the championship.
03:02Yeah, the Knicks still don't make sense to me.
03:05Like, you know, we went from, okay, depth is the most important thing, and you need this big rim-protecting
03:10center,
03:11and you need Jalen Brunson not good enough to be a number one option.
03:14And the Knicks just completely broke the mold with everything we thought to be true, you know, for an NBA
03:20champion.
03:21So, yeah, absolutely.
03:23And like you said, LeBron can fit anywhere.
03:25You know, if he comes back to the Cavs, I think he's a good fit.
03:27I think the team that needs him the most is Minnesota because they need a power forward more than any
03:33other team perhaps needs any other position.
03:36I don't see LeBron going to the Timberwolves and babysitting LaMelo Ball and Anthony Edwards
03:40and these guys that are talented but probably need a little bit more maturing.
03:45I can't see that happening.
03:47Yeah, I think you could plug LeBron in to basically any role.
03:50He can play the three.
03:52He can play the four.
03:52He can play on the ball.
03:53He can play off the ball.
03:54And, you know, this isn't – we've seen him play a third role, like you said, with the Lakers.
04:01We've seen him be a third leading scorer in the regular season and be successful.
04:06But like we saw in the Olympics two years ago, when the game is on the line, who did all
04:11those guys go to?
04:12Steph Curry and Kevin Durant.
04:14So often it's still funneled through LeBron at the end of games.
04:17And I still think, you know, in many playoff scenarios that would be the case.
04:21Do you think we are more giving scenarios we think would make sense and then turning that into a destination
04:29for LeBron
04:30instead of what really he is maybe after?
04:33Like Indiana doesn't seem to be a – no offense to the fine folks in Indianapolis, Indiana,
04:38but it doesn't seem to be a destination for LeBron James in his final year.
04:43Neither does Minneapolis, Minnesota.
04:45But when I see these things, I'm like, yeah, it makes sense.
04:48It would make sense that he would join there if it were just based on winning and that's it for
04:52a year.
04:55Yeah, I think, you know, for us Clevelanders that have grown up watching him,
05:01I feel like we know him more than anybody else in the national media.
05:05And there's a couple things that we know about LeBron, right?
05:07Like he wants to compete for a championship, great.
05:11He's given up the money aspect if he will indeed sign for the veteran minimum.
05:15But he wants to be respected.
05:17And I think that's something he lost in Los Angeles.
05:21You know, how many Lakers fans didn't want him there in the beginning
05:24because they were so devoted to Kobe Bryant?
05:28And how many Lakers fans, you know, when he left were on social media saying,
05:32good riddance, we don't need him.
05:33And the fact that when they brought in Luka Doncic and they had a sit-down meeting with him
05:39at a restaurant that ESPN reported, they're talking about the future of the team,
05:42they didn't talk about LeBron.
05:44They didn't ask LeBron's opinion.
05:46Last year, Dave McMahonman wrote a great article about how, you know,
05:49he expected the game ball because he had set this record for most wins
05:52and the team gave it to J.J. Reddick instead.
05:55And he had to play that third role that, you know,
05:58him and Austin Reeves have a great relationship.
06:00I don't think he was thrilled that Austin Reeves was getting the ball more than he was on offense.
06:05So he wants his respect.
06:07This is his last chance to cement his legacy and really, you know,
06:11kind of sway those last, you know, half of people.
06:14Oh, is it Jordan? Is it LeBron?
06:16He wants his respect.
06:17And I go back to who's going to respect him more
06:20and give him his flowers more than the city of Cleveland.
06:24All right. Greg Schwartz joined us right now on the hotline.
06:26Now, you have been as critical as anybody from the moment you heard James Harden's name
06:31as a potential trade target.
06:33And obviously, it ended up being a very mixed bag with James.
06:37He helped him get to the Easter Conference Finals.
06:39His highs, I thought, were pretty high.
06:41His lows were as low as it gets.
06:43And then, you know, I thought he hit a wall big time in the Knicks series.
06:47I was worried about that matchup.
06:49And then you end up being right in the end, right?
06:51Like, the way it ended, he did not help him win a championship.
06:54And we're in championship mode every single year.
06:58However, Greg, I'm a little confused as to some of the people nationally
07:03who are saying, oh, LeBron's not going to play with James Harden.
07:06That just doesn't fit.
07:07He can't win in the playoffs.
07:09Like, if anything, James, my hope is he's our fourth best player next year,
07:13not the guy playing the most minutes in the playoffs of any of our players.
07:17So, if he's in the right role, why couldn't they make that work?
07:22Yeah, I think you're really going to have to have some humility
07:26if you're James Harden.
07:28And I don't know if he's willing to do that or not.
07:30I don't know him.
07:31But, yeah, he's going to be 37 next month.
07:35Certainly has a lot of wear and tear on the tires.
07:38That's the good thing about him is, yeah, he's always healthy
07:41during the regular season.
07:42But I really think that does affect him in the postseason.
07:45Like, because you're playing 70 games
07:47and you're playing 36 minutes a night
07:49and you have such a large role offensively every single year,
07:52I do think that plays a big part in the fact that he melts down
07:56in the playoffs year after year after year.
07:59So, yeah, you can make the argument that, okay,
08:01if we have Donovan as our one, LeBron as our two,
08:05even Evan as our third scoring option,
08:08and we say, James, we just want to focus on playmaking.
08:10You know, we don't want you to have the ball
08:12for the last 10 seconds of the shot clock
08:15and it's just step back, step back, dribble, dribble, dribble.
08:17Like, yeah, we have to deprogram you from doing that
08:21because that's what you've always done
08:23because you've been a terrific player.
08:25You've been the number one option.
08:26I don't know if he's willing to do that.
08:28I don't know if you can do that.
08:30You know, James Harden and I are the same age.
08:33Am I going to go out tomorrow
08:33and start lifting weights every day?
08:35Probably not.
08:36I'm not going to do that.
08:37So I don't know if he's going to completely change
08:39his playing style and what he does as well.
08:42So if he commits to being a facilitator
08:46and he will average 15 points per game
08:48and be happy with that,
08:49that could be very mutually beneficial
08:51to both James Harden, potentially LeBron James,
08:54and the Cavaliers,
08:55especially if they want to make a long playoff run.
08:56See, Greg, I thought we were on the right track
08:59at the end of the year in the regular season.
09:01I thought they were playing almost as efficient
09:04as anybody in basketball those last 24 games.
09:08And I know they had a litany of injuries,
09:09so they never had the same lineups.
09:11But James, I thought his passing was remarkable.
09:15I thought he was perfectly willing to,
09:18hey, this is your game, Donovan, go ahead.
09:20I thought in the playoffs,
09:22I thought him with the ball in his hands
09:24at the end of the clock was more a byproduct
09:25of everything the rest of the team was incapable of.
09:29I thought the grenades that were thrown back out to him,
09:32you know, with six on the clock
09:34when others could not create,
09:36that is where I saw there to be a big problem.
09:39They should have never been relying on James Harden
09:41to be such a focal point.
09:44And again, he played more minutes
09:46than anybody in the NBA playoffs,
09:48than anybody that was not a finals participant.
09:52Like, that's crazy at age 36.
09:55Well, yes, and he also had more turnovers
09:58than any player in the NBA playoffs
10:00without going to the finals.
10:01But isn't that one thing lead to the other, though?
10:06Wasn't it the fact he was playing too many minutes?
10:09He did have too much of a role on the team
10:12when they could not rely on other guys to playmake
10:14at the level that we thought they could?
10:18To an extent.
10:19And I would say that when you got James Harden,
10:21you changed the dynamic of the team,
10:23for better or worse.
10:24He became the number two scoring option.
10:27Ideally, at this stage,
10:28you would have Evan Mobley be in that role.
10:29I think we can all agree with that.
10:32Jalen Tyson's role was severely reduced
10:35when they got James Harden into the playoffs,
10:39which that drove me nuts
10:40because you needed a guy with fresh legs
10:42who could defend,
10:43and he was sitting on your bench right there,
10:45and Tyson and Kenny Atkinson refused to play him.
10:48So his role changed, too.
10:50So I think, yes, like you said,
10:53I'm not a James Harden fan.
10:55I'm not thrilled that we're going to give him
10:57a multi-year deal at $30-plus million a year
11:00as he gets ready to turn 37.
11:01I'm not thrilled with that.
11:03But if you get LeBron and you kind of say,
11:06okay, now we've got a training camp with you.
11:07We're more comfortable.
11:09We want to focus on making sure Evan and Jalen
11:12and all of our young guys are involved as well.
11:14We need you to take a step back,
11:15and you don't have to handle this burden.
11:17You don't have to have this load
11:18that you had in the playoffs.
11:20Yeah, I could see it looking much better
11:22in year two than it did in year one.
11:24Do the Cavs need, underline the word,
11:27need LeBron to win a championship this season?
11:30No.
11:32They were just in the Eastern Conference Finals.
11:34They were a Final Four team.
11:35They were knocking on the door.
11:36I still believe not to take anything away from the Knicks.
11:40The Knicks had the easiest path that I've ever seen.
11:43They were just playing teams coming off of seven-game series
11:47over and over and over again.
11:48These are the same Knicks that were down 2-1
11:50to the Atlanta Hawks in the first round,
11:52and then they just started playing these old, tired,
11:56worn-out teams that had come off these grueling series.
11:59So, no, I don't think they need LeBron,
12:01but they need LeBron to make a decision
12:03because then it's like, okay,
12:04we've got to get the James Harden contract done.
12:07Are we going to go after Jonathan Kaminga?
12:09Because now it seems like the Lakers are in the need for him.
12:11Do we try to sniff around Peyton Watson as an option
12:15in a sign-and-trade, which I would be thrilled with
12:17as a young 3-and-D, 6-foot-8 wing who can score the ball?
12:22Like, there's not a lot of options,
12:25but there's some options that you can turn to.
12:27But if they don't get LeBron,
12:29the best way that they can improve the team
12:31is through the trade market
12:32because it's not like they have, you know,
12:34those free agency dollars to spend.
12:36Greg, thank you so much for the time, man.
12:38You're absolutely wonderful.
12:40Wishing you the very best
12:41and hope to talk to you again soon, buddy.
12:43I think you guys are wonderful, too.
12:45Thanks for having me on.
12:46Greg Swartz joining us on the show
12:47on the Wise Heart Right.
12:48We make it right.
12:49Call Kyle Wright Hotline from The Bleacher Report.
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