- 10 minutes ago
2020 Oscar nominated actors Tom Hanks (two-time Oscar winner) and Adam Driver joined Oscar-winners Robert DeNiro and Jamie Foxx and actors Adam Sandler and Shia LaBeouf for the full Actor Roundtable.
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00:00:07Hi, and welcome to Close Up with the Hollywood Reporter Actors.
00:00:11I'm Stephen Galloway, and I'd like to welcome Adam Sandler.
00:00:15Yes, sir.
00:00:16Robert De Niro.
00:00:17Hi.
00:00:17Adam Driver.
00:00:19Tom Hanks.
00:00:20Present.
00:00:21Jamie Foxx.
00:00:22Yes, indeed.
00:00:22And Shia LaBeouf.
00:00:23Thanks so much for being here.
00:00:25I'm sure you know this anecdote.
00:00:27Dying is easy.
00:00:28Comedy is hard.
00:00:30True or false?
00:00:32Comedy is more difficult, yes.
00:00:33I can't do what Billy Crystal does, Eddie Murphy, you, Adam.
00:00:41But I can do other things.
00:00:43I mean, I like to think that I work in, say, in Marty's movies, just situations that are funny in
00:00:50and of themselves, which is like life.
00:00:54You know, there are so many situations.
00:00:56We see we're in a situation all of a sudden, I wish we could have filmed this, or this situation
00:01:02is so crazy, you know, but it's real.
00:01:04Is there anything in real life you wish you could have filmed or that you've then brought into a role?
00:01:10No, I mean, the only thing to say with Marty Scorsese working with him is that you get closer to
00:01:18saying that whatever you want to do, you can actually try and do it.
00:01:23And maybe it'll happen, maybe it'll work.
00:01:26If you had an idea or something, you say, let me just try that.
00:01:29I say, Marty, let's just try it.
00:01:31You never know.
00:01:31And so it's something, with some directors, you don't even go there.
00:01:39You don't even, you say, it's too much work to even attempt to bring it up to them to do
00:01:46that.
00:01:47With Marty, it's, this is, we'll do it, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work.
00:01:52So that's a great feeling of freedom, and it's just great.
00:02:00Adam, you come from comedy.
00:02:02Yes.
00:02:02Comedy or dying.
00:02:04Yes, yes.
00:02:05Which one sees you?
00:02:08You know, if you have something that, either way, something you're confident with, something that seems like you believe in
00:02:17it, I think it's the same feeling.
00:02:19If you believe in a joke, if you believe in a dramatic scene, you go in there with the same
00:02:25approach, I would think, right?
00:02:28Here's the thing.
00:02:30Comedy is a natural thing.
00:02:33Like, I just told him, I was watching him in the comedy store when I was 18 years old, sneaking
00:02:38in the comedy store.
00:02:39Yeah.
00:02:40Watching him go up when it was like titans, it was rock, it was Eddie working out, you know, shit.
00:02:46I remember Eddie had on like a, like this yellow fucking Century 21 jacket.
00:02:53He was working on these dogs and somebody, yo, what's up with that Century 21 jacket?
00:02:57And then you watch Eddie, like, he said, oh, whatever, I'll crush you with my wallet.
00:03:01And then everyone started laughing.
00:03:02So, it's interesting, when I look at everybody here, you know, it's this, it's this, it's respect, and then I
00:03:09look at Adam, I'm like, oh, shit.
00:03:11Before he even said anything, I'm already laughing.
00:03:14So, that's one of the first ingredients is that when you have this natural thing of watching him on his
00:03:21guitar at 1.30 in the morning, doing a bit that he's so dedicated to it, motherfuckers, it's like, oh,
00:03:29he's, you know, shit.
00:03:29So, that's the first ingredient, right?
00:03:32That's correct.
00:03:33And then the second ingredient is, as comedians, you get a light.
00:03:36Like, you get that liftoff, that launch, where everything that you're saying is funny, it's hilarious, like, people are giving
00:03:43you that light.
00:03:44I think it only becomes difficult once you reach that top of comedic level.
00:03:52Now, people are expecting, you know, the world.
00:03:56You know, when I go talk to Eddie, I was at Eddie's house, and he's talking about getting back into
00:04:01comedy, into stand-up.
00:04:03Yeah.
00:04:03But he's like, how do, you know, I said, well, I said, well, Eddie, if you want to get into
00:04:06it, I could help you.
00:04:08First thing you gotta do, you gotta fix your house.
00:04:10He's like, what you mean?
00:04:11I said, your house is too, too perfect.
00:04:14All your, it's too much.
00:04:16You got the candle scented and all that shit.
00:04:18I said, Eddie, at my crib, I have shit at my house that doesn't work on purpose, so I stay
00:04:23funny.
00:04:23I got this little carpet that's in the kitchen that's sort of ruffled up, and I got a bathroom where
00:04:29you turn on the faucet and it sprays out.
00:04:31And my daughter's like, why don't you fix it?
00:04:33I said, I feel like if I fix all this shit, I won't be funny.
00:04:37So it's like, you have to have that.
00:04:39And then, when he talked about the situation, like when we're watching, you know, Robert De Niro, the situation that
00:04:48you provide for him makes it all the way funny.
00:04:52Does that make sense?
00:04:53Yes.
00:04:54Because now, once you have the ability to be funny, you need the situation in order for it to make
00:05:00sense.
00:05:02Because if not, like this is the worst thing in the world when the director goes like, okay, now just
00:05:07do your thing.
00:05:08Ooh.
00:05:08Oh.
00:05:09Yeah, yeah.
00:05:09And now you, you know, fucking.
00:05:11Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:05:11You're doing your shit, and then when you watch it, you're like, I'm doing my shit, but it doesn't make
00:05:14sense.
00:05:15So that's the part when he says.
00:05:16Do they only say that in comedy or do they say it in drama?
00:05:18Oh, dear.
00:05:19They all say, have fun with it.
00:05:20Commit to it.
00:05:21You know.
00:05:22Can you be funny if you grew up with a built-in swimming pool in your backyard?
00:05:26I don't think you can.
00:05:27If you grew up being able to swim anytime you wanted to, you experienced none of the shortcomings of life
00:05:34that you'd turn into self-deprecation.
00:05:36That's right.
00:05:36You can't do it.
00:05:37It's tough.
00:05:37Can you play tragedy, though, if you grew up, if you have it easy?
00:05:40Doesn't it all come from some inner pain, angst?
00:05:44Everybody's.
00:05:44Yeah, sure.
00:05:45You bet.
00:05:48Look, it's like Bertolt Brecht, man.
00:05:51The whole thing is a struggle, and there's where you find your triumph.
00:05:54You hear the thing about it that will kill us all at some point is it's 3 o'clock in
00:05:59the morning, and you have something very specifically that you know.
00:06:02You've known for months you're going to act this beat with this scene, and it's 3 o'clock in the
00:06:06morning.
00:06:07And it could be anything from rain birds going off to, you know, taxi cab drivers or something like that,
00:06:13honking horns.
00:06:13And it's like, all right, the movie is now upon your shoulders.
00:06:17Don't fuck this up.
00:06:19And then they sit back, and you wait, and you've got to go there, man.
00:06:22You've just got to.
00:06:23Tragedy?
00:06:24Comedy?
00:06:24Is there a moment you can think of where that's just a taste of stuff?
00:06:27Well, it happens 10 times a week sometimes, you know, where it's everybody is kind of, everybody's making the same
00:06:36movie you are.
00:06:36You know, the crew, the teamsters, everybody knows that, oh, today's the scene you're going to, you know, oh, wow,
00:06:41this is going to be Bill and Luke.
00:06:42We shut down the whole street for this, you know.
00:06:45All right, 11 o'clock.
00:06:47Okay, we're ready for a rehearsal.
00:06:49Hi.
00:06:49Hi, please, give me a gun so I can shoot myself in the hip and not have to do this
00:06:54movie anymore.
00:06:55You played a comedian in the movie with Sally Field.
00:06:59Oh, Punchline.
00:06:59Hey, the Safdie brothers told me to tell you that they love Punchline.
00:07:04Is that right?
00:07:04They watch Punchline a lot.
00:07:06Playing a guy who's supposed to be funny, the only way to do that was to go out and develop
00:07:12funny material.
00:07:14And I probably did six, you know, appearances of something where all I really did was jump up and down
00:07:20on a trampoline.
00:07:21I had no sense of anything.
00:07:22But you were, because I saw you training, I was a young comedian at the comic strip, and you used
00:07:30to come in and go up there with, and Barry Sobel used to come in.
00:07:33Oh, yeah, Barry, Barry and I, we ended up, and I ended up, after a while, not that night, not
00:07:39if you saw me at the comic strip.
00:07:40No, I saw you a couple times, and you were good.
00:07:42You came up right away where the comedians were mad that you were calm on stage and cool, and you
00:07:47were being yourself.
00:07:48That took a while to get there.
00:07:49But the best I can describe it is you just have to go there.
00:07:54When I was in junior college taking acting classes, and there's ten of us there, and we've all been to
00:07:59the American Conservatory Theater performances of certain things,
00:08:02and we usually look at comedies going, oh, yes, that's very funny.
00:08:06Oh, I appreciate the work behind that joke.
00:08:09But the assignment for one day was, okay, on Wednesday, everybody's going to come, and you're going to be funny,
00:08:15and you're going to make each other laugh.
00:08:17And it was stone, nothing.
00:08:19No one could do anything funny because that was the task at hand.
00:08:23So, comedy is hard because you know instantaneously whether or not your soup is good food.
00:08:30Adam, you were in the military.
00:08:34See?
00:08:34Right away.
00:08:37Acting, and trauma, and dying, or comedy, do they seem trivial in comparison?
00:08:41Well, I mean, one, the stakes you're pretending are life and death, and the other, they kind of are.
00:08:45But the way, the process in which you work on them is the exact same.
00:08:49It's, you know, a group of people trying to accomplish a mission that's bigger than any one person, and you
00:08:55have a role, and you have to know your role within a gun team.
00:08:58And you're only as good as the people that are there with you.
00:09:01There's someone leading it, and when they know what they're doing, what you're doing feels active and relevant and exciting.
00:09:08And when they don't, it feels like a waste of resources and dangerous.
00:09:11And you're just so aware that you're one part of a bigger picture.
00:09:16How did you switch from being a Marine to being an actor?
00:09:19I was interested in it before being in the military.
00:09:22Then when you get in the military, you get out, you kind of have all this false confidence that civilian
00:09:26problems will be small in comparison, which is an illusion.
00:09:28But then I was lucky enough to get into an acting school and learned about acting and plays and a
00:09:35process.
00:09:36Then I was lucky enough to work.
00:09:37Have you ever felt, Char, that there's a life and death moment in acting where your whole life depends on
00:09:43you pulling this off?
00:09:44Yes.
00:09:44Which one?
00:09:46Every time.
00:09:46It feels like your neck's on the chopping block every time.
00:09:49How do you get past that anxiety?
00:09:52Prep hard.
00:09:53Yeah.
00:09:54It's like boxing.
00:09:55It's just like boxing.
00:09:56Guys train really hard to go put their neck on the line.
00:10:00Never been in the military, but it feels life and death to me.
00:10:03Yeah.
00:10:04So prep hard.
00:10:05Determination.
00:10:07I went last year to the Harry Ransom Center.
00:10:11I don't even know what that is, but it's the archive at the University of Texas, which has great papers.
00:10:16And there are Bob's papers.
00:10:19And to actually see your handwriting on, you know, the Raging Bull script.
00:10:24And it was amazing because your scripts are covered with notes.
00:10:29What was the toughest character I actually had to prepare for?
00:10:32Well, they're all different.
00:10:33Depends.
00:10:34Some are harder in some ways than others.
00:10:37Raging Bull, because of the weight and all that.
00:10:40And the mission, just the physical stuff.
00:10:44Awakening.
00:10:45There's a lot of physical stuff, too.
00:10:46And studying how my character behaved and what his affliction was.
00:10:52And then Raging Bull, I read the book.
00:10:55Somebody handed me the book, one of the authors.
00:10:57And I read it while I was doing it once in 1900 with Bertolucci.
00:11:01And I called Marty from Italy and I said, you know, the book's not great literature, but it's got a
00:11:08lot of heart.
00:11:09And I kind of want to do certain things.
00:11:11I remember I used to see Jake LaMotta.
00:11:14He'd work in a kind of a strip place right on 7th Avenue in the 40s.
00:11:19He'd be standing right out there near the sidewalk and he was overweight and this and that.
00:11:23I said, Jesus, look what happened to him from then.
00:11:26And I thought just the graphic difference of being out of shape and then being a young fighter, really, that
00:11:34was interesting to me.
00:11:35I thought, you know, I'd like to see if I could really just gain that weight actually and do it.
00:11:41So that was my interest in it.
00:11:44Marty had his reasons and both of us just come together on the project.
00:11:50And, yeah, so.
00:11:52Have any of you had a dream project that you've taken to a director or another act and said, you
00:11:56must do this?
00:11:57Honey Boy, it's your project.
00:11:59You wrote it.
00:12:00Yeah.
00:12:00But if you haven't seen it, it's terrific.
00:12:03It's unbelievable.
00:12:04And the man is incredible.
00:12:05So who did you want to do it with you?
00:12:09My back was against the wall.
00:12:11I was nuclear at this point.
00:12:12So it wasn't like a dream project.
00:12:13It felt like survival.
00:12:16Like there was no other way to go.
00:12:18I didn't have a lot of people talking to me.
00:12:20I was in a mental institution.
00:12:21So it wasn't like, oh, this is my dream project.
00:12:23I'd like to explore this.
00:12:24It was like my back's against the wall.
00:12:28This is the craft that I love and I can't do it anymore.
00:12:31And I also had a doctor who was pushing me to explore these dirty parts and write it down.
00:12:36And, yeah, so it wasn't like a dream project thing.
00:12:40It felt more like necessity, like survival, like something different.
00:12:45You said you were in a mental institution.
00:12:48I don't want to ask you two personal questions.
00:12:50But is there anything you discovered there that's been helpful for your acting?
00:12:55Yeah, empathy for my father, you know, who was always the biggest villain in my life.
00:12:59You know, and I think if you can empathize with the biggest villain in your life and sort of scrape
00:13:04some of these shadows and it makes you lighter and freer.
00:13:07I don't think I was leading with love and my life has changed.
00:13:11You may or may not attest, but I feel like when you lead with lightness and love, you can get
00:13:15to the heavy easier.
00:13:16You know, it's much more accessible.
00:13:19Like anger and the rough shit is very easy.
00:13:21You know, it's the other stuff that feels quite difficult.
00:13:24You know, getting honest laugh is very hard.
00:13:27I tell you, when I have to laugh in a movie, I can't do that.
00:13:30Yeah, it's tough.
00:13:31You mean like laugh?
00:13:33If my character is supposed to have a genuine laughing moment, I'd rather get genuine anything else.
00:13:39I'm always just like, no.
00:13:41Is it easy for you to cry?
00:13:43You have that big moment in Uncut Gems where you're really emotional.
00:13:47Was it easier than laughing?
00:13:49Maybe, maybe not.
00:13:50I'm not great at crying.
00:13:52What are you great at?
00:13:53I'm not sure yet.
00:13:54I don't even think I should be at this table at all.
00:13:56No, but, yeah, crying when it's written in a script and then he breaks down and this, that kind of,
00:14:05that really gets me tense for a while.
00:14:09You had a massive one in Marriage Story.
00:14:11Every time I see that performance of somebody breaking down, I'm like, oh man, that's incredible.
00:14:17How did you get to that point?
00:14:19It's not something you push for.
00:14:20You don't push for emotion.
00:14:21It either happens or it doesn't.
00:14:23You can't anticipate it or nothing will happen.
00:14:26But, you know, there's a lot of things in that instance that are supporting you.
00:14:29You're, the script is so good and it's well-written.
00:14:32If it was badly written, there's only one way to do it.
00:14:34If it's well-written, you know, the language is so rich that every time you say it, it opens up
00:14:40an idea for something else.
00:14:43It's awesome because Noah has structured, and Adam knows this from working with Noah and Meyerowitz.
00:14:46It's the text is the text, and I find that incredibly freeing because your intention could be anything.
00:14:51And if you're with another actor as Scarlett in that instance, and, you know, the set Noah's giving you another
00:14:59piece of information that may be unthought of before, or the line, or you've gotten a fight with your wife
00:15:04before the scene starts, or maybe nothing.
00:15:06Maybe you're having a good moment before the scene starts.
00:15:09It just opens up your imagination of a different way of reading it.
00:15:13You know, he's taken basically a four-month run of a play and condensed it to two days, you know,
00:15:19so I think that's easier.
00:15:20If it's just having emotion, I don't think I can do that.
00:15:23Do you take that emotion home with you?
00:15:25I don't think so.
00:15:27I mean, I don't know.
00:15:28It's like a release after it's done.
00:15:29Take the exhaustion home.
00:15:31No.
00:15:32No, I mean, it's a release.
00:15:34It's like you did that, that's there, take a break, come back.
00:15:38Sometimes, though, there is a residual something that you have to be aware of, I think, as an act.
00:15:44For you too, Tom?
00:15:46There is a, it's a physiological process that incorporates your emotions in the sinews of your body.
00:15:54It's funny, laughing and weeping are two very physical acts.
00:15:58You know, they're not up here.
00:16:01I mean, when I cry, man, my face turns into rubber.
00:16:04Oh, yes, yes.
00:16:05You know, you bend over into some kind of thing.
00:16:08And you can only, you can only get there if literally the text takes you there.
00:16:14And there's this great commonality of moments like that in which, like I said earlier, everybody's making the movie and
00:16:20everybody knows that tonight or this day is going to be an emotional thing.
00:16:24And your job is to forget that it's on a schedule and just live it and be it and don't,
00:16:32don't, you can't, you can't push it.
00:16:35It actually has to, has to come out.
00:16:37Well, I'm just, I'm just emotional.
00:16:40Yeah.
00:16:40I'm always crying.
00:16:41I'm just.
00:16:42Really?
00:16:42Yeah, I just, I cry for everything.
00:16:44That's great.
00:16:45I don't know, but I'll be crying about stuff that really, my accountant just called me and said, you.
00:16:51You don't have, you tried to buy a private plane and she was like, fuck, run the scene.
00:16:56But it's like, you know, I mean, I should be going through my life.
00:16:59She gets us all, you know, when we get that call.
00:17:02She just ruins the game.
00:17:04Shit is going on in my life, so I'm easy.
00:17:06I cry easy.
00:17:07What's been your toughest moment?
00:17:09I think the toughest thing being a comedian is watching other comedians blow, like Eddie blow.
00:17:14Oh, shit, you know, and then, you know, Martin.
00:17:17And so I'm like, okay, where's my, where's my thing?
00:17:19But then you see that they've touched all of the comic bases.
00:17:23I remember going in and reading for Russell Simmons.
00:17:26Uh-huh.
00:17:27For some, for some comedy and I was doing my thing and he was going, no, that's, that's, that's Eddie.
00:17:33Oh, that's Martin, that's Martin, that's Martin, that's Martin right there.
00:17:35Oh, no, no, no, no, that's, no, that's Rock, that's Rock.
00:17:38And I'm like, what the fuck is going on?
00:17:39And he was, no, I was just saying, you, you sound like Chris Rock, you sound like Eddie.
00:17:43So that was tough because I was like, damn, I don't have nowhere to go, right?
00:17:47And then like, you know, this cool thing where Oliver Stone opened up.
00:17:51It was, you know, this any given Sunday thing, which was more dramatic.
00:17:54And, and so I don't know if that's a tough thing, but it was just like, man, let me, let
00:17:59me go get with him.
00:18:00And it was an incredible, it opened up a whole nother thing.
00:18:03And then the tough part was getting back to being funny.
00:18:06Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:18:07Yeah, because like, you know, like the young folks, they see me like, oh, here's this dude using Django.
00:18:12Right, right, right.
00:18:12And now I'm doing jokes and saying, man, why Django being funny like that?
00:18:15So it's like, so now I have to try to get back to.
00:18:19What about you?
00:18:19Do you find that hard too often?
00:18:21I've done so many comedies.
00:18:23I have so many comedies on TV.
00:18:25I don't have a hard time getting back into that.
00:18:27People are just, when I get to do something like this, like Uncut Gems, and I haven't done that many
00:18:34dramas.
00:18:35Maybe I've done like six or seven, over 30 years worth.
00:18:39I'm always excited doing them.
00:18:41It's a different excitement for me because I'm not sure of myself.
00:18:44You know, when you do comedies, you kind of, I mean, you grew up doing them.
00:18:49Shia grew up as a kid being in comedies.
00:18:52It's a different, lighter feel on the set.
00:18:55It's exciting.
00:18:56There's nothing better for a comedian than going home and going, oh, I think we killed that scene.
00:19:00That's going to be funny.
00:19:01It's how the audience is going to like that.
00:19:03But this drama man, getting it right and feeling like you gave it your all and that excitement of reading
00:19:10script and going, oh, that scene's going to be incredible.
00:19:13Then actually shooting it and it comes out the way you want it to, or maybe not exactly the way
00:19:18you want it to, but something happened big for you.
00:19:21That's as good as it gets.
00:19:22Are you hard on yourself when it doesn't come out that way?
00:19:24Do you go ahead and torture yourself?
00:19:25Oh, my God.
00:19:26If there's something great written that I don't think I got to where I was supposed to get, I'm really
00:19:33mad at myself.
00:19:34You too?
00:19:35Yeah.
00:19:35Yeah, you're disappointed.
00:19:37The only thing is that you, like you were saying, you don't push for anything.
00:19:41I mean, I don't.
00:19:42If you push, you're not going to get it.
00:19:44So you just have to take what comes and try and find ways to get there.
00:19:49But you just can't be anxious about it.
00:19:51You know, it's like the thing, you know, the actor, he can't remember his lines, so he can't act anymore.
00:19:56So he's working in a garage and somebody, an actor, the director comes over and says, listen, I just want
00:20:01you to say, Hawk, I hear the cat and roll in the third act.
00:20:03You know, so I said, okay, so I'll go do it.
00:20:06So he rehearsed, rehearsed, and then at home, you know, he's working, Hawk, I hear the cannon roar, Hawk, I
00:20:11hear the cannon roar, Hawk, I hear the cannon roar.
00:20:13Every variation, every way he's ready, the third act, ready to go after five weeks rehearsal.
00:20:18He goes backstage, he's ready, you know, the first act goes, no problem, he's waiting, Hawk, I hear the cannon
00:20:22roar, I hear the second act, everything, fine.
00:20:26Third act, he's there backstage, and stage manager comes, okay, ready, and he's hearing the play out there.
00:20:32Boom, go on, he's going, I'm saying, Hawk, I hear the cannon roar, Hawk, I hear the cannon roar.
00:20:36Then you hear, bang, turns around.
00:20:38What the fuck was that?
00:20:48Are you self-critical?
00:20:51Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:52I mean, I don't think that you ever get over, because in a way, you kind of know what your
00:20:56potential is more than anybody else, in a sense.
00:20:58I have a lot of regret often when you leave a set, you can't help but, you know, think about
00:21:04it, and, you know, obviously it's film, so film is forever, so you never get a chance to go back
00:21:08and do it again.
00:21:09I feel like that's the thing about acting, is that you, regardless of how often you do it or how
00:21:16long you do it, you never figure it out.
00:21:18Even in the, do you prefer theater because of that, or?
00:21:20I've learned from theater in that, you know, always at the end of a four-month run of a play,
00:21:25you're always the last performance, it's always the best one, and you're like, okay, now I have a better sense
00:21:29of what I want to do and go back.
00:21:30So I know that there's no right answer.
00:21:32There's no right way to play a scene.
00:21:35That's my part of it.
00:21:36I like the making of it, and it's someone else's responsibility to make the choice of what is the best
00:21:40version of it.
00:21:41But I know that there's no right way, and you would just have to feel comfortable with failing, and you
00:21:48either get easier on yourself, I think, about like, okay, then I'll just, I'll let it go, or you don't.
00:21:54But I don't think you'll ever figure that out, so I think people keep doing it, I think, but I
00:22:00don't know.
00:22:01I'm looking at you, Tom.
00:22:03Are you self-critical?
00:22:04Did you go home and drive, or?
00:22:07There have been too many times where I thought I really cracked something over the fence, and then I saw
00:22:12it, and I said, well, that is just, what the, that's as exciting as a closing door.
00:22:18And there's other times I said, I had no, I didn't, I didn't, all I could do was stumble around
00:22:23a day, and it's fantastic.
00:22:26And there's no, it's odd, you almost have no control.
00:22:30For me, it has come down to whether or not the, the procedure and the behavior that was asked of
00:22:37you is authentic.
00:22:39And if it is, then you've got to leave it up to serendipity.
00:22:42And those, that, those fabulous people that are willing to look at your, you know, every eyebrow and pour on
00:22:49your face and decide what's going to be the best take, or what, what, what's going to end up being
00:22:54in the movie.
00:22:55Do you know when it's, I would even say, in a way, it's not even your job, really.
00:22:59I mean, I, I think it's, it's not your job to feel anything.
00:23:05It's the audience's job.
00:23:06So I obviously have been thinking about something for a long time, and you finally get there and do it.
00:23:11You want to feel something just because you feel like you put the effort in.
00:23:14But it's, it's not really my responsibility to feel something.
00:23:17It's to telegraph that something is being felt, you know, but it's hard to reconcile that, to not feel like
00:23:23you got there and you actually, it's, it feels like it's going to be more authentic.
00:23:27But, I mean, to, to your point, you could be having all the feeling you want, but no one is
00:23:31feeling anything.
00:23:32And that, and your job is to tell the story, not have a feeling in front of people.
00:23:37When we were, when we were doing Captain Phillips, and we were in this lifeboat, the script had all these
00:23:42great moments where Rich Phillips looked through the porthole of the lifeboat.
00:23:46And as the sun was going down and was thinking of his family at home and whether or not he
00:23:50was going to see them.
00:23:51So you could sit around in Malta, you know, where we were shooting is, oh, that's going to be a
00:23:56powerful moment.
00:23:57Because I'm going to, you know, I'm going to line up in the porthole and just going to be like
00:24:01this, you know, it's going to be really great.
00:24:03Then you go to work and there is no porthole in the lifeboat.
00:24:10So you got to like take away, it's almost, oh, you cannot prepare.
00:24:14You can only just be there.
00:24:15The movie process, it's a little bit different, if you know what I mean.
00:24:20It's like.
00:24:21You mean in theater?
00:24:22Just not even that.
00:24:23Just like when I was on any given Sunday, I remember Oliver Stone, when I first auditioned, was like, you're
00:24:31horrible.
00:24:32When I auditioned and I was like, what?
00:24:35Because I was a television actor.
00:24:37So everything I did was loud.
00:24:38Yeah.
00:24:39So you better understand this with the football in the air, man.
00:24:44And he was like, get the fuck out of here.
00:24:47Oliver Stone can be tough.
00:24:48Very tough.
00:24:49No, but it was, but I learned from that toughness, meaning like when he finally decided to, you know, make
00:24:56the decision for me to be the lead, he still would grill me.
00:25:00He said, that's not it.
00:25:01That's not it.
00:25:02That's not it.
00:25:03I'm working with Quentin Tarantino, and I watched an actor struggle because the set was like, it was heavy.
00:25:11I mean, you had, you had Samuel Jackson here.
00:25:14You had Leo.
00:25:15I mean, it was some juggernauts, you know, and Samuel, come on, motherfuckers, say that shit.
00:25:19And the dude was trying to say, come on, come on, get it.
00:25:22Oh, yeah.
00:25:22And the guy was trying to get his line, and I watched Quentin Tarantino go to him, no, everything's fine.
00:25:27Just say line.
00:25:28Right, yeah.
00:25:28And I was like, damn, this shit ain't going to work out, right?
00:25:30But then you see the movie.
00:25:31Boom.
00:25:32Boom.
00:25:33Boom.
00:25:33So on, so on, so on.
00:25:34So I said, God damn.
00:25:36And Quentin said, all I need is one.
00:25:38Sure.
00:25:39Even working with Christoph, Christoph Waltz, watching him work, I learned a little more about movie.
00:25:46I watched him fold a paper.
00:25:48This motherfucker wrote on a thing and was just supposed to put it in his pocket.
00:25:52It seemed like it took him forever to do it.
00:25:54It was like, and he had, it was nothing else existed but that moment, right?
00:26:07Christoph Waltz's process wasn't that I'm going to have all of these things memorized and do all of these things
00:26:13at once.
00:26:13He would give you these, calm yourselves, gentlemen, I, one more time.
00:26:19Calm yourselves, gentlemen, I am but a weary traveler.
00:26:23And we were watching it and Leo was like.
00:26:27I said, Leo, you think you got it?
00:26:29He's got something, pal.
00:26:32Just keep watching, some shit is going on, pal.
00:26:35And you see all these little bits of things and then all of a sudden in the movie, boom, calm
00:26:41yourselves, gentlemen, I was like, oh, shit.
00:26:44And then I'd like to thank the Academy.
00:26:49I like that about Oliver because you hear so many stories about people who've worked with him.
00:26:53Who, Shai, has most intimidated you that you've worked with and who have you learned from the most?
00:26:59Everyone's intimidated by Oliver, right?
00:27:01Yeah, different, not intimidated.
00:27:04He would never look me in the eyes.
00:27:06He always looked just above my eyelid.
00:27:08Really?
00:27:09Yeah.
00:27:10Why?
00:27:11It's just his way.
00:27:12Maybe just with me.
00:27:14But probably being around Hardy.
00:27:16Hardy's a bit of a gorilla on a set.
00:27:18Tom Hardy.
00:27:18Yeah, probably.
00:27:19I was most intimidated by him.
00:27:22What do you mean a bit of a gorilla?
00:27:23Well, he runs a set, you know, he pee in the corners.
00:27:26It's his set.
00:27:27You know it when you get there.
00:27:28Oh.
00:27:28Yeah.
00:27:29Don't feel like a shared space.
00:27:30It feels like his space and, you know, and he's a very good actor and also super loving.
00:27:36But on a set, you're in his church.
00:27:39Who has taught you the most?
00:27:41Bob.
00:27:42Really?
00:27:42Yeah, definitely.
00:27:43I don't know if I really like that.
00:27:44I'm not surprised.
00:27:45We can all just be quiet.
00:27:47Yeah.
00:27:51We have some great actors around this table, let's face it.
00:27:54And what did he teach you?
00:27:56Well, through the performances, I watched him reveal himself and be a presenter of a soul
00:28:03and explore who he was through the work.
00:28:07And I've always just, he made it feel sacred to me.
00:28:13So it felt like he lifted the craft into something that felt like a, it's wild to hear you say
00:28:20you're not religious, but I know you're spiritual and I don't have to ask you because I watched
00:28:23the work and I can feel it.
00:28:25So I'd say, and not to, you know, kiss ass, but through the work, having a guy to look towards.
00:28:32Are you intimidated by anyone?
00:28:36Well, there's always somebody, I guess.
00:28:39I don't know.
00:28:40I don't know.
00:28:42But as you get older, you don't want to be intimidated by anybody who shouldn't intimidate you.
00:28:47If you, you know, we're in a political situation now.
00:28:51We have the best example of that, where I feel that you must stand up to this kind of
00:28:58person, not to make a speech about this here, but it's, it's necessary to stand up and not,
00:29:06because people are nonplussed.
00:29:07It's like, they say, did this guy just do that?
00:29:11He did it.
00:29:12I don't even know how to react to that because I'm like, that's not within my world of common
00:29:17sense or, or right and wrong or what's being fair.
00:29:20So I, I have to find a way.
00:29:22I just have to, you gotta, you gotta push him back.
00:29:25You gotta, you gotta snuff him out.
00:29:27You gotta get rid of him.
00:29:29He's a, he's a, you know, it's, it's, you gotta deal with it because, but people are
00:29:33so, so nonplussed by this behavior.
00:29:38And that's how crazy people like him can get even further.
00:29:42Imagine him getting a second term.
00:29:44He'll want, he's even said, I want to be president for life.
00:29:47He choked about it.
00:29:49And so then he'll, he'll go for that.
00:29:51He'll, he'll pardon himself.
00:29:52He'll do anything.
00:29:54I thought in the beginning, you know, well, you know, he's a New Yorker.
00:29:57Maybe he's got common sense somewhere in there.
00:29:59He's a liberal actually, supposedly.
00:30:02But then, you know, after he, you know, he just got worse and worse and worse and worse.
00:30:07And we, we, we've got to get rid of him.
00:30:09Adam, should access be political?
00:30:11Oh, I'm not great at that.
00:30:15I, I, I, I listen to Bob talk and I, I go, okay.
00:30:18I listen to, I, I have, I, when I, when I, when I, my conviction is not great.
00:30:23I do, I do believe in, uh, I, my, my way of being, uh, I just try to be, uh,
00:30:34as good of a
00:30:35person I can be and try to conduct myself a certain way.
00:30:38I don't think I always do that.
00:30:40Right.
00:30:40But, um, when it comes to me discussing politics, I don't think I'm, I don't think I'm knowledgeable
00:30:46enough to, to go at it.
00:30:47It's an interesting thing because it's actually not politics.
00:30:51What he's talking about is me letting my kids watch someone who is supposed to be from mayor,
00:30:58whatever, they're supposed to be different.
00:31:00He's not talking about politics.
00:31:01He's talking about the human nature of things.
00:31:03And so we should all have an opportunity to say or not say, but I, I got kids, so I
00:31:09got to tell my kids, I say, hey, listen, this is not the way things are supposed to be when
00:31:14it comes to the human nature of it.
00:31:17Because when you do ascend to these levels of, of running things, we look to that.
00:31:22Look, all of what we, what we've gone through in our lives as, as American and politics, we
00:31:30were always able to look at that office and say, that's something to aspire to be and
00:31:35to be like.
00:31:36If I can't let my kids listen to that person talk, then that's where we're off.
00:31:42So it's not actually politics.
00:31:43There's nothing wrong with saying, hey, I'm like this.
00:31:46You can have a different, you can have a disagreement with me about policy.
00:31:51We can both do that because I got good old boyfriends that are, that are red state guys
00:31:57and I got Democrat friends.
00:31:59I'm a Democrat, but I'm in all of those circles because I'm always performing.
00:32:02You know what I'm saying?
00:32:03Mm-hmm.
00:32:05And quietly, even if we disagree, there's always that point of being a man, being, being nice,
00:32:13being kind.
00:32:14And so to his point, when you see something where a person is, bless you, when a person
00:32:20is just, yo, you don't have to dance in the end zone with everything.
00:32:23God bless you again.
00:32:24I'm sorry.
00:32:24God bless you.
00:32:25But, but I think that's, that's what it is.
00:32:27And then we all get nervous, you know, we get nervous because, well, what's, what's,
00:32:34what are people going to say about me?
00:32:36But then if we don't have someone saying something, bless you again.
00:32:40I don't know where that came from.
00:32:41Bless you again.
00:32:42It's all good.
00:32:42But if you don't have someone.
00:32:48No, I don't got it.
00:32:49Go ahead.
00:32:49But you know what I'm saying?
00:32:51So it's like, it's, it's, it's not politics.
00:32:56It's human beings.
00:32:56It's like, I know, I, I, look, I, I, I, I can share this story.
00:33:02I did a gig for Jerry Jones, who's, I'm a cowboy, huge cowboy fan.
00:33:08And I had to perform for the, for the owners in the NFL.
00:33:13And Jerry Jones' son-in-law said, what are you going to do here?
00:33:16I have to perform for, you know, you know, some good old boys.
00:33:20And I said, don't worry about it.
00:33:22I'm good.
00:33:22I'm from Texas.
00:33:23I, I think I'll be good.
00:33:24So the first thing I sung was George Strait.
00:33:26And they went, oh, next thing you know, by the end of the night, I had everybody singing
00:33:30Gold Digger and Blame It On It.
00:33:32I got Colin Powell singing.
00:33:33But I got a chance to speak with George Bush.
00:33:38I'm this close.
00:33:39And I was like, we spoke.
00:33:41And, of course, we all had our differences.
00:33:44But I asked him something.
00:33:46I hope he doesn't mind me sharing this story.
00:33:48I said, would you ever say anything disheartening about President Obama?
00:33:53And you know what he said?
00:33:54No.
00:33:55I wouldn't.
00:33:56It's too hard of a job.
00:33:57I learned so much.
00:33:59I would never knock his legs out from under him because I know what it is.
00:34:03And then I watched him and his kids play with Obama's kids.
00:34:07That's what it's about.
00:34:09You know, if we're being, if we're taking it there, that's what it's about.
00:34:11So it's just, it's a matter of everybody has something that they want to say, but we shouldn't
00:34:17be afraid to say it.
00:34:18You're not going to be, we should just say, hey, man, that just ain't cool.
00:34:20So when Ellen DeGeneres went to the game with George W. Bush, do you think that's okay?
00:34:25Listen, it's bigger than that.
00:34:26When we're in, I've seen, I've been in football games where Jesse Jackson, George Bush, everybody,
00:34:34they're still humans.
00:34:35But what happens is, it's an interesting thing.
00:34:38When you see what media does, they always separate and make it something bigger.
00:34:45Ellen is sitting with George Bush, who she's known for years.
00:34:48That's, it's not a big thing.
00:34:50Still doesn't, still doesn't mean she's going to compromise what she believes in.
00:34:54And you don't have to do that.
00:34:56I think, I think it's always been that way.
00:34:59Only now, it's just different because you do go like, wow, that ain't cool.
00:35:04Even if you felt that way, that part ain't cool.
00:35:07You know what I'm saying?
00:35:08So it's like, we shouldn't be, we shouldn't be afraid.
00:35:11We, look, and like people say like, oh, he's a snobby actor.
00:35:15You know, elitist.
00:35:16What the fuck are you talking about, man?
00:35:17I came from Terrell, Texas.
00:35:19No money, no nothing.
00:35:21I said, nothing snobby about me.
00:35:22I'm happy that I'm making my money.
00:35:24I said, but for me to get to a position of where I'm at right now and not say nothing?
00:35:30Like, what, you know?
00:35:32So I'm, like I said, I'm not running for office.
00:35:34But damn, we should be able to say whatever we want to say when we want to say it.
00:35:37Does that make sense?
00:35:37Yes.
00:35:38Tom, you had a little Freudian cough going on there.
00:35:40Do you disagree?
00:35:41I don't know where that came from.
00:35:42There was a cough of agreement, what was going on.
00:35:46We all, we all have to.
00:35:48Shut up.
00:35:52I'm going to give you three more of those.
00:35:55Those are freebies after that.
00:36:01Not everybody should be political, but everybody must be principled, and we carry our principles
00:36:06with us 24 hours a day.
00:36:08It's part of the countenance.
00:36:09It's part of why we do what we do in the first place, and it's in our choices.
00:36:16I have to say one of the things I learned from the get-go as an actor in a repertory
00:36:22company
00:36:23of people you worked with, you didn't have to like those people, and you did not have
00:36:26to agree with those people.
00:36:28You didn't have to hang with those people, but you had to respect those people.
00:36:31You had to respect their process, and you had to respect their opinions.
00:36:36And the default setting, I think, for so much of everything is conflict, and what's the
00:36:45word I'm looking for?
00:36:46Cynicism.
00:36:47That's the first place I think everybody can go.
00:36:50So if Ellen is at a football, at a game with George W. Bush, what's the cynical take on
00:36:57what that is?
00:36:58Right.
00:36:59As opposed to, what is the respectful take on that?
00:37:03I'm not going to assume anybody automatically agrees with each other because they're in
00:37:07a Dallas Cowboys or an Oakland Raiders football game.
00:37:10And I think that's a difference.
00:37:13And also, kind of like political views are a dime a dozen.
00:37:17They're absolutely everywhere.
00:37:24You just played the least cynical guy, maybe in history.
00:37:29Is it actually harder to play someone that nice than to play a villain?
00:37:35They're the same exact beast.
00:37:40Granted, Mr. Rogers is not Iago, but they have their principles, and they have their mission
00:37:48statement.
00:37:49The story in the movie is really about the journalist that is very cynical about who Mr. Rogers is
00:37:55and finds out that he was wrong.
00:37:59And there's no nefarious motivation between what Fred Rogers did for a living.
00:38:06He viewed it as his ministry.
00:38:08And that's kind of like looking at some combination of Mother Teresa or somebody that is hell-bent
00:38:15for doing just good in the sphere of which they operate.
00:38:20And the cynic walks into that and says, what's your racket here?
00:38:24What are you trying to pull here?
00:38:26And if it's actually just, well, we're trying to feed the homeless people some soup so they
00:38:30get a hot meal once a day.
00:38:32No, there's got to be something more to that.
00:38:33There's not.
00:38:34And Fred Rogers was an ordained minister, and his principle was such that everything that
00:38:42guided him through his daily behavior and his creative output was based on making people
00:38:48feel safe and a part of something bigger than they actually were, in his case, two- and three-year
00:38:52-old
00:38:52kids.
00:38:52But he never, ever said the word God, not in hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of hours
00:38:58of television.
00:39:01Hello, Lloyd.
00:39:03Oh, it's nice to meet you.
00:39:05What?
00:39:05Are you all right?
00:39:07Plate to plate.
00:39:08Oh, I see.
00:39:09That looks like it hurts.
00:39:10Uh, let's chat afterwards.
00:39:11We need to keep moving.
00:39:12Maybe we could have Evan take a look at him.
00:39:14No, I'm good.
00:39:15I'm good.
00:39:16I'm sorry, Fred.
00:39:16Yeah.
00:39:17Me too.
00:39:18All right.
00:39:18All right.
00:39:21It's wonderful to meet you.
00:39:22So glad you're here, Lloyd.
00:39:23I'm looking forward to talking with you.
00:39:27I truly am.
00:39:28After this.
00:39:30When you explored that character, was there a darker side in him that actually pushed him
00:39:36in the other direction?
00:39:37There was the same dark side in him that is in any cracked vessel of humankind.
00:39:42There is doubt.
00:39:45There is a sense of failure.
00:39:47There is always a degree of self-loathing.
00:39:49There was always a question of, am I doing enough for the people that I love?
00:39:54Now, is that a dark side?
00:39:57I don't know that it's dark.
00:39:58And look, not everybody says, I'm growing tired of this game, Mr. Bond.
00:40:02Perhaps you'd like a tour of our installation before we feed you to the sharks.
00:40:06Not every, that is, that is, I think that's a dynamic that comes about and that's, you know,
00:40:11Shakespeare wrote that kind of stuff left and right.
00:40:13But the journalist who came and talked to Mr. Rogers was paying that, no, no, no, there's
00:40:17something in the past and you're doing this for some reason in the future.
00:40:20And that's, that's an artificial accounting that is required by somebody who is not the
00:40:26person themselves.
00:40:28Bob, when you're playing a guy who's killed people, as you just did, and it's a real,
00:40:32based on a real life man, is it good for you personally to find the goodness in him?
00:40:38Or is that a dangerous proposition?
00:40:42I don't think, I mean, he was a guy who happened to have seen a lot of combat in the
00:40:46Second World
00:40:47War.
00:40:47So he was a little, he was inured to killing more than someone else.
00:40:54And he found himself in this world that was not what he was from and it fit.
00:41:00And he was loyal to the people that gave him the love and support and respected him.
00:41:07And so that's how, and then he was, then he had a big conflict, which later on, not to
00:41:14give it away, but that was the whole thing.
00:41:17But I think the whole story, the story is very simple.
00:41:20You could find that kind of situation in any culture.
00:41:25I can't tell you what this means to me to get this honor from you.
00:41:29The highlight of my life.
00:41:31Thank you very, very, very, very much.
00:41:33And this man, James Riddlehofer, is the guy that gets the job done.
00:41:41I'm behind you, Jimmy.
00:41:43All the way.
00:41:46In any case, from the deepest part of my heart, I thank you all, because I don't really deserve
00:41:51all this.
00:41:58Loyalty, betrayal, love, all those things are there.
00:42:03The price in this world is a little more harsh, but, you know, and maybe not so in certain
00:42:12parts of the world.
00:42:12I mean, this is what happens.
00:42:15So we have it in this country, in America, in that milieu, that culture.
00:42:21It's what it is.
00:42:23So your loyalty in the movie to your work, it was very interesting to see how it affected
00:42:32your home life and your daughter in the movie.
00:42:34Yes, yes.
00:42:34That was what was very interesting and different to the fact that, you know, a person would love
00:42:41you for what you do and how much you believed in doing the right thing for the guys you
00:42:47were employed by.
00:42:48And that, but at home, it was affecting the family.
00:42:53It's heartbreaking, heartbreaking.
00:42:55Your movie does the same thing.
00:42:57Oh, yeah.
00:42:57Right.
00:42:58That relationship that you have with your two boys and your wife, man, who is just so completely
00:43:04done with you.
00:43:05Yeah, yeah.
00:43:07And she, in real life, is a dominatrix, I heard.
00:43:11No, maybe not.
00:43:14Who's the dominatrix?
00:43:14Yes.
00:43:15Yes, she is.
00:43:15Who is?
00:43:16Who's the dominatrix?
00:43:17The actress in the film that you play with.
00:43:20Oh, you have to ask her, but.
00:43:25I'm going to check that before we run that.
00:43:27Yeah, you might want to be a little bit more specific on these counts, man.
00:43:30I don't want to be sued.
00:43:31Adam Sandler.
00:43:33You said something about editing.
00:43:35How much research did you do for that part?
00:43:37Did you go into this?
00:43:39Let's give Adam a test.
00:43:40How much is Jenny's watch?
00:43:42Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:43:43That's a real thing.
00:43:44I would.
00:43:45You know, this was a gift.
00:43:46Instagram.
00:43:47That's a gift from.
00:43:49No, somebody just told me post.
00:43:50And I was like, hey.
00:43:51Yeah.
00:43:51Oh, there you go.
00:43:52That's a good one, Shia.
00:43:53That's a good one.
00:43:54That's what you want to get.
00:43:56Did you spend a lot of time with you?
00:43:57I spent a lot of time, of course.
00:43:58Yes, I worked out.
00:43:59What surprised you about that?
00:44:00Well, I'll tell you.
00:44:01Like Shia said, when you do the research and you come into a project and you know everything,
00:44:07and what Mr. De Niro was saying, when you walk onto a set and you know you've done the homework
00:44:17and you have no fears of like, oh, if this comes up, I'm going to be, I'm going to shut
00:44:22down.
00:44:22It's just great to, so of course, I spent a lot of time on 47th Street.
00:44:26I gamble in the movie a lot, so I spent a lot of time with a lot of gamblers who
00:44:30had bad problems
00:44:31and lost a lot of things and lost their lives because of it.
00:44:35The gamblers you met, who most surprised you?
00:44:39Well, the Safdie brothers, the guys who did the movie, they did the research and met a lot of guys
00:44:45who were willing to sit down with me and talk, and there was nothing, it's just their lives get thrown
00:44:51away
00:44:51and their family lives get thrown away, and it's about where they are right now,
00:44:56and they discussed what the highs and lows were and why they couldn't stop and that kind of feeling.
00:45:04Take a look. Let's see.
00:45:05Are you serious? You're going to pull this up right here?
00:45:07Look at this shit. The Sixers are supposed to win the game tonight, they think.
00:45:11We don't keep tracking on that shit. Who gives a fuck?
00:45:13They think on game seven you're not going to get fucking 18 points.
00:45:16They don't think you're going to get eight rebounds?
00:45:18These guys don't know shit about both.
00:45:19What the fuck are they doing? Doesn't that make you want to fucking kill them?
00:45:23Doesn't that make you want to say, fuck you for doubting me?
00:45:25Doesn't that make you want to step on fucking Elton Brand's fucking neck?
00:45:30All these guys on the block let me in their shops, and I got to sit with them and watch
00:45:34them,
00:45:34and they taught me about the jewelry and about selling, and I watched them all day long,
00:45:40and it was a lot of fun. It felt neat to learn this.
00:45:45It wasn't boring.
00:45:46Well, no, not at all. It's good to learn something.
00:45:48I walked away thinking I knew everything.
00:45:50Right now, it's a year later, I'm like, I forgot so much. I wish I didn't.
00:45:55You played a real-life character.
00:45:58When you're playing that role, how much do you have to be faithful to him,
00:46:03and how did you think differently?
00:46:07The process of playing somebody real, you have to sort of not do the impersonation,
00:46:16because I'm, like, you know, coming from, like, the 11 color background.
00:46:19I learned not to do the impersonation, and then also not to, I didn't have a chance to see him
00:46:26actually alive,
00:46:27but I had to sort of, like, piece things together through what people would say,
00:46:30and then the first thing that helped me was aesthetically.
00:46:34We are part of the same tribe, in a sense.
00:46:36Our cheekbones, the diamond-shaped head, that haircut that he had, I had that in the 80s as well.
00:46:43So, aesthetically, we were ahead of the game.
00:46:47I didn't have a chance to see him actually alive,
00:46:49but I had to sort of, like, piece things together through what people would say.
00:46:53And then talking to Bryan Stevenson and hearing him talk about how...
00:46:57Who's the real-life attorney...
00:46:58Who's the real-life attorney who, you know, goes and meets this guy on death row
00:47:04and finds out all these incredible, these horrible things that he's on death row without a trial.
00:47:09They say he killed a white woman in the city that he'd never been in,
00:47:12and, like, he couldn't believe that this existed.
00:47:15But he told me how Walter was.
00:47:17He felt like, you know, since I'm in this situation,
00:47:20I might as well do everything I can to help.
00:47:23So when you see him in the movies talking to all the prisoners and everything like that,
00:47:26trying to keep up their morale,
00:47:27all these guys on death row.
00:47:29So I took that as the spirit of it,
00:47:31and then it was a matter of the vernacular,
00:47:34being in, you know, Alabama,
00:47:37and the way they talk like that,
00:47:39the way they say their things,
00:47:41and, you know,
00:47:42and to make that not be caricature.
00:47:45Like, I remember Michael B. Joy,
00:47:46listen, no, don't do that,
00:47:48because it started sounding like something
00:47:51where we really couldn't understand me.
00:47:53So we sort of dialed that in.
00:47:54So sometimes you have to rely on the people that are around you
00:47:57to say what makes the most sense.
00:47:59That and real experience to draw upon.
00:48:02I mean, you know,
00:48:05my father came to one of the screenings who,
00:48:08you know,
00:48:08he was an educator for 25 years in the hood,
00:48:10in high school,
00:48:12and everything he dedicated his life to,
00:48:14saving black kids in the hood.
00:48:16They end up putting him in jail for $25 worth of illegal substance for seven years.
00:48:22Wow.
00:48:22So here he is in jail with kids that he had taught.
00:48:27Wow.
00:48:27The very judge that he would bring into the school and say,
00:48:30hey, I want you to shake these kids up.
00:48:32Tell them the repercussions of anything.
00:48:38That judge presided over his case,
00:48:40put him in jail.
00:48:43So when you have something like that,
00:48:45the person that taught you how to throw a football,
00:48:48the black man that taught you how to play tennis in Texas,
00:48:51when we weren't allowed to go to the country club,
00:48:55I said, well, I got to learn tennis,
00:48:56because you don't know all of this.
00:48:57You don't know how to swim, tennis,
00:48:58all of the stuff that they say we can't do,
00:49:02and so that was a huge thing that I carried inside.
00:49:06I didn't share it with a lot of people,
00:49:08because when my pops, I wrote him one letter,
00:49:10because I was telling somebody,
00:49:11I don't like to see people in jail.
00:49:13I wrote him one letter.
00:49:14You get out, I'll save your life.
00:49:15He came to live with me.
00:49:16When he went in, I wasn't who I was.
00:49:19When he comes out,
00:49:20and I got a chance to take him to the U.S. Open
00:49:24and have him watch Venus play,
00:49:29and watch the tears.
00:49:32So those types of things.
00:49:34Now, I was lucky enough to be able to have that moment,
00:49:38but in Walter McMillan's situation,
00:49:41it works out, but it doesn't work out.
00:49:43It's still an entertaining movie,
00:49:44but you still sit with, like,
00:49:46wow, Walter McMillan didn't have a chance,
00:49:48and there's a lot of Walter McMillan.
00:49:50You can buddy up with these white folks
00:49:52and make them laugh,
00:49:53and try to make them like you, whatever that is,
00:49:55and you say, yes, sir, no, ma'am,
00:49:56but when it's your turn,
00:49:57they ain't got to have no fingerprints.
00:50:00No evidence, no evidence.
00:50:02And the only witness they got
00:50:04made the whole thing up.
00:50:10And none of that matter
00:50:11when all y'all think is
00:50:13is I look like a man
00:50:15who could kill somebody.
00:50:19but that's not what I think.
00:50:22You shot in a real-life prison, right?
00:50:25Because those prison scenes are phenomenal.
00:50:27They're really incredible.
00:50:29Did you think...
00:50:30The one moment when the cuffs was being put on me
00:50:33and they had a guy who was part of the prison system
00:50:36who wasn't part of the movie,
00:50:37yeah, yeah, squeeze it tighter.
00:50:39Oh, yeah.
00:50:40Squeeze it tighter,
00:50:41because he's a bigger one.
00:50:44Squeeze it tighter.
00:50:46He doesn't know that he's saying something
00:50:49that is taking me to,
00:50:51like, I'll come out these cuffs.
00:50:53But that's his everyday life.
00:50:55Uh-huh.
00:50:56So those moments
00:50:57when we were going into those prisons,
00:50:59that was...
00:51:01for a person who don't...
00:51:02I don't do the jail shit.
00:51:05You know, there was a couple of times
00:51:05I was like, hey, man, don't squeeze them.
00:51:08They're tight enough.
00:51:09You know what I'm saying?
00:51:10So he doesn't know that he's saying something
00:51:13that is taking me to,
00:51:15like, I'll come out these cuffs.
00:51:18But that's his everyday life.
00:51:20Uh-huh.
00:51:20We become so used to it, too,
00:51:22because we're talking to Brian Stevens
00:51:24and talking about changing the perception
00:51:25because the perception kills us.
00:51:27It's like,
00:51:28the reason I don't want to go see somebody in jail
00:51:31is because I don't want to get used to that.
00:51:33But so many people are just used to seeing their father,
00:51:35their brother, who are their mothers in jail.
00:51:38And the next thing you know,
00:51:39we start rapping about it.
00:51:41We should rap about being in jail
00:51:42because we don't have any other thing.
00:51:44This is all we see.
00:51:46So it's a...
00:51:47You know, it was a tough...
00:51:49It's a tough thing, you know?
00:51:51Such a wonderful film.
00:51:54You played your own father.
00:51:56Yeah.
00:51:57And he was...
00:51:58I don't know if this is fair,
00:51:59but it seems that in your real life,
00:52:01he was a pretty villainous guy.
00:52:03Oh.
00:52:04I don't know.
00:52:05Is that true?
00:52:05No, he's a sweetheart.
00:52:06He's a teddy bear.
00:52:07He's just a little crooked.
00:52:11Cracked vessel?
00:52:12He's just a cracked vessel.
00:52:13Yeah, that's right.
00:52:14That's right.
00:52:15But there's a lot of cracks there.
00:52:16Yeah.
00:52:16Did you...
00:52:18Did you have to change how you saw him
00:52:21to play the role?
00:52:22And did playing the role change the way you saw him?
00:52:24Yeah, for sure, yeah.
00:52:25I hadn't talked to my dad for seven years
00:52:27before I started this up,
00:52:29so I didn't really...
00:52:30I didn't really know my dad too well.
00:52:33And didn't have a relationship with him at all.
00:52:37And my coming into this industry...
00:52:41You know, my dad wanted to be in this industry.
00:52:43He sort of separated us.
00:52:44You know, there was like a lot of competitive...
00:52:47Me and my dad were quite competitive with each other.
00:52:51And, yeah, I guess...
00:52:53Yeah, I guess you always got to empathize
00:52:55with whoever you're playing,
00:52:56but I wouldn't call him a villainous character.
00:52:58No way.
00:52:59Why does she have a job?
00:53:02Think it through.
00:53:03Play the tape out.
00:53:04What's your mother got a job for?
00:53:05Huh?
00:53:07Just in case.
00:53:08In case what?
00:53:08In case what?
00:53:10I don't know.
00:53:10In case you fail.
00:53:12In case it don't work out.
00:53:13Yes, man.
00:53:14She's filling your head full of fear.
00:53:15I don't ever do that, do I?
00:53:17Huh?
00:53:18I pump you full of strength.
00:53:19Because we're on a team,
00:53:20and I know you got what it takes.
00:53:21You're a fucking star, and I know it.
00:53:23That's why I'm here.
00:53:24I'm your cheerleader, honey boy.
00:53:26Yeah, and I hadn't really looked at him from that side.
00:53:28You know, I was young and, you know, victim type of, you know,
00:53:34I was using my dad at work, you know,
00:53:37which was the wrong way to go about work,
00:53:38but also the wrong way to see my father.
00:53:39What do you mean you're using him?
00:53:40Well, you know, I was working with material
00:53:43that wasn't necessarily, you know, bomb back,
00:53:47and this material would ask of you things
00:53:49that you couldn't really get in the material,
00:53:51so then you're left with, and I didn't have any technique,
00:53:55and I had read all these stories, you know,
00:53:59easy riders, raging bulls, and, you know,
00:54:01you kind of, you come up with an amalgamation
00:54:04of a way to do something,
00:54:05and for me it was a lot of transposing my pain
00:54:07from my father, and it would work in front of a camera
00:54:11for me for a long time.
00:54:12It didn't have much more technique than that,
00:54:14and I was scared to sort of clean it up
00:54:15because I thought, well, you know,
00:54:17I don't want to lose my only thing I got,
00:54:19which was this pain that felt very real for me,
00:54:22and so, yeah, I had a whole mixed bag of,
00:54:27I had a strange way of viewing my pain with my father,
00:54:31and I also used it at work,
00:54:33so I didn't want to clean it up, yeah.
00:54:37Has it changed your thinking about him or anything?
00:54:39Yeah, and made me better at my craft
00:54:41and created a relationship, and, yeah.
00:54:45Did you ever think of not playing the part,
00:54:47and did you ever think of directing it?
00:54:49Never thought of directing it
00:54:50because that's just not my gig,
00:54:51but definitely didn't think I'd be able to play it, you know.
00:54:55I was not in a spot where people were like,
00:54:57hey, let's put some money on this kid's back
00:54:59and have him carry a movie,
00:55:00so I thought my acting career was done.
00:55:02I was going to join the Peace Corps.
00:55:04I wasn't really trying to.
00:55:05Yeah, I was out completely, yeah,
00:55:08and, yeah, sent it to Mel Gibson,
00:55:10and, yeah, I thought he was the guy to play my dad,
00:55:14and my dad was also thinking along the same lines.
00:55:18It's one thing to want to play your dad.
00:55:19It's another thing to go stand in front of your father
00:55:21after seven years and not talking and go,
00:55:23hey, man, I'm going to play you
00:55:24when there's contention already,
00:55:26and we weren't on good terms,
00:55:27so I lied to him and told him,
00:55:29hey, Mel Gibson's going to play you, son, right here,
00:55:32and my dad loves Mel Gibson.
00:55:35Who doesn't want to be played by Mel Gibson?
00:55:36Yeah, so my dad signed the paper under the auspices
00:55:39that he was going to be played by Braveheart, you know, so.
00:55:44Well, you had the Noah Baumbach script,
00:55:46but this is an autobiography,
00:55:49so in some ways, were you playing Noah in the film?
00:55:52I mean, like all of these things,
00:55:54Noah wrote a script.
00:55:55He did that hat trick that people, I think,
00:55:57tried to do of writing something
00:55:59that's incredibly specific,
00:56:01but it reaches a broader audience.
00:56:03I mean, like anything, like Meyerowitz,
00:56:05like, you know, squid in the way of while we're young,
00:56:08they're all, in a sense, autobiographical,
00:56:10but he wrote something that I think we all projected
00:56:12our history or onto.
00:56:16You're being so much like your father.
00:56:19Do not compare me to my father.
00:56:20I didn't compare you to him.
00:56:22I said you were acting like him.
00:56:23You're exactly like your mother.
00:56:24Everything you're complaining about her, you're doing.
00:56:26You're suffocating Henry.
00:56:27First of all, I love my mother.
00:56:29She was a wonderful mother.
00:56:31Just repeating what you told me.
00:56:31Secondly, how dare you compare my mother
00:56:33to my mother?
00:56:34I may be like my father,
00:56:36but I am not like my mother.
00:56:38You are.
00:56:39What was the toughest moment for you in that film?
00:56:42Or was it one that you really struggled with?
00:56:44Usually there's like one scene in a movie
00:56:47or maybe two that you're dreading.
00:56:49With this one, every scene felt like,
00:56:51oh, it's all too early in the schedule.
00:56:53It's too early for Halloween.
00:56:54It's too early for...
00:56:55Put it on for you.
00:56:56Yeah.
00:56:56And like, okay, well,
00:56:57then we can maybe put it to next week,
00:56:59but the next week's was worse, you know?
00:57:01So, and again, that's, I think,
00:57:03a testament to good writing.
00:57:04Every scene felt the stakes were incredibly high.
00:57:08They all felt urgent.
00:57:09They all felt necessary.
00:57:10There wasn't a part that you could take out
00:57:12where the movie would survive without it.
00:57:13And so that, I think it was our first sign of,
00:57:16oh, this felt like it always should be this urgent,
00:57:19hopefully.
00:57:20Last question for all of you.
00:57:22If you could go back to your younger selves,
00:57:25well, you in a way went back to a younger self,
00:57:28an Irishman, younger than that,
00:57:29what piece of advice would you give yourself?
00:57:32Well, I was saying something to my grandson
00:57:34the other day because, you know,
00:57:36that things, just be calm.
00:57:39When things are going well, be calm.
00:57:42Don't think you're on top of the world in a sense.
00:57:45You always got to be wary because I've seen it.
00:57:48I've seen people come.
00:57:49I've seen people go.
00:57:50I've seen them come.
00:57:51I've seen them go.
00:57:52You got to be chill.
00:57:54You got to, like, just take what's good in your life
00:57:56and move forward cautiously and carefully
00:57:59and thank God that you have that.
00:58:03Just, it's very, very important not to overextend yourself
00:58:07when you think you, you know, you've got to,
00:58:10there's no such thing.
00:58:12Everybody's dispensable.
00:58:14I wish I had known that this too shall pass.
00:58:17You feel bad right now?
00:58:19You feel pissed off?
00:58:20You feel angry?
00:58:21This too shall pass.
00:58:22You feel great?
00:58:24You feel like you know all the answers?
00:58:26You feel like that everybody finally gets you
00:58:29and there you are?
00:58:31This too shall pass.
00:58:33Time is your ally.
00:58:36And if nothing else, just wait.
00:58:39Just wait.
00:58:39Just wait it out.
00:58:41I'll take Tom's.
00:58:44Adam?
00:58:44Being more economical, I think I would,
00:58:47I wish I could be.
00:58:49Things that I think I need, I don't,
00:58:51whether it be acting or, you know, life.
00:58:54Economical, artistically, financially, emotionally.
00:58:57Well, we can say artistically, I guess,
00:58:58if you think that you need to,
00:59:01certain things have to be in place for you to do your job,
00:59:03but then actually none of that's true.
00:59:05Where you were using the example earlier of a porthole,
00:59:07having it worked up in your mind
00:59:09and then realize you're getting there,
00:59:10you have no control over any of it, you know, so.
00:59:13Or doing homework and research and like, you know,
00:59:15losing weight and putting up a bunch of weight
00:59:17and then feeling comfortable to let it all go
00:59:19because none of that is helpful
00:59:20because your scene partner is drunk.
00:59:22I'm just pulling that out.
00:59:24That's not something that's happened to me.
00:59:25I'm just pulling something out of it.
00:59:27But being more economical with, you know,
00:59:29okay, well all that time I have to either get better about
00:59:33that I've wasted it
00:59:34or I shouldn't just waste that time
00:59:35and actually should prioritize in a different way.
00:59:38So I think that's kind of the same thing.
00:59:39Adam.
00:59:41Can I say one thing?
00:59:42Couldn't you ask them to put a porthole in there?
00:59:45Well, here's, you know what the thing was?
00:59:47Is that I felt as though that I was relatively calm
00:59:50and experienced enough that I didn't do this.
00:59:53Is there anybody who could have told me this?
00:59:57Because someone had put in the script
00:59:59there was a lack of portholes in this lifeboat?
01:00:04And I said, all right, all right.
01:00:06So there's no lifeboat.
01:00:07There's no porthole.
01:00:08You did have that extraordinary moment
01:00:09everybody talked about in the film where you cried.
01:00:11And I remember you said at the last round table
01:00:14that you'd had 10 minutes to prepare for it.
01:00:16Not even that.
01:00:17We just kind of like went down and...
01:00:19Adam, lost man sitting.
01:00:21I was thinking, because I should have stretched more.
01:00:26I have a very bad back.
01:00:29I can't get out of my car.
01:00:31That's like the floss answer.
01:00:31I should have flossed.
01:00:32I should have flossed more too.
01:00:34I think even metaphorically.
01:00:35No, no, no, no.
01:00:37I'm fine with all that stuff.
01:00:39But I really can't get out of my car
01:00:40when there's a loose ball on a basketball court.
01:00:43I cannot get the ball ever.
01:00:45Everyone else grabs it before me
01:00:46because I can't bend.
01:00:48And my coaches always growing up
01:00:51were like, always talking about stretching.
01:00:53I never did it.
01:00:54I never did it.
01:00:55I always jumped right into the game.
01:00:57Did you stretch before playing?
01:00:58No, not too much.
01:00:59See?
01:01:00No, I don't.
01:01:00But that three ball was wet, though.
01:01:02I got to tell you.
01:01:03Yeah, thank you.
01:01:04Not as wet as it used to be.
01:01:06Good.
01:01:06But all of you, thank you so much.
01:01:08This was truly a terrific round.
01:01:10I really appreciate it.
01:01:11Thank you very much.
01:01:12You're welcome.
01:01:12It was great.
01:01:13Thanks.
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