- 8 months ago
John and Christian discuss how “loaded language” within cults and charismatic movements creates communication barriers, spiritual elitism, and moral confusion. They explore how words like faith, doubt, spirit-filled, and Jezebel spirit carry entire doctrines that alienate others and discourage honest inquiry. Drawing from their experiences leaving high-control religious groups, they show how language can shape identity and restrict thought—turning simple words into tools of control.
Together they examine how even well-meaning Christians can drift into self-righteous rhetoric and “church-speak” that isolates them from both outsiders and fellow believers. The conversation connects biblical examples, psychology of cult speech, and cultural references like Harry Potter to show how prideful communication dehumanizes others and undermines the gospel’s inclusivity.
00:00 Introduction
01:00 Language Barriers in Pentecostal and Branham Movements
03:30 The Problem of “Exalted” Christian Language
06:30 Miscommunication and the Charismatic “Season”
09:00 Loaded Language and Cult Control
12:00 The Anti-Christian Nature of Exclusionary Speech
15:00 “Touch Not God’s Anointed” and Other Silencing Phrases
19:00 Pride, Hierarchy, and the Abuse of Spiritual Authority
21:00 Faith vs. Doubt: The False Dichotomy
22:00 “Spirit-Filled vs. Religious” and the Canon Fodder Mindset
25:00 “God Told Me” — The End of Honest Discussion
28:00 Language Drift Between Denominations
33:00 Charismatic vs. Biblical Language
36:00 When Christianity Becomes Esoteric
38:00 Paul’s Example: Meeting People Where They Are
41:00 Harry Potter and the Real Lessons About Prejudice
45:00 Jezebel Spirit and Misused Bible Terms
50:00 The Cost of Poor Communication
53:00 Dehumanizing the “Outsiders”
56:00 Conclusion and Reflections
______________________
Weaponized Religion: From Christian Identity to the NAR:
Paperback: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1735160962
Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DCGGZX3K
______________________
– Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham
– Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ
– Visit the website: https://william-branham.org
– Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg
– Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham
– Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr
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Together they examine how even well-meaning Christians can drift into self-righteous rhetoric and “church-speak” that isolates them from both outsiders and fellow believers. The conversation connects biblical examples, psychology of cult speech, and cultural references like Harry Potter to show how prideful communication dehumanizes others and undermines the gospel’s inclusivity.
00:00 Introduction
01:00 Language Barriers in Pentecostal and Branham Movements
03:30 The Problem of “Exalted” Christian Language
06:30 Miscommunication and the Charismatic “Season”
09:00 Loaded Language and Cult Control
12:00 The Anti-Christian Nature of Exclusionary Speech
15:00 “Touch Not God’s Anointed” and Other Silencing Phrases
19:00 Pride, Hierarchy, and the Abuse of Spiritual Authority
21:00 Faith vs. Doubt: The False Dichotomy
22:00 “Spirit-Filled vs. Religious” and the Canon Fodder Mindset
25:00 “God Told Me” — The End of Honest Discussion
28:00 Language Drift Between Denominations
33:00 Charismatic vs. Biblical Language
36:00 When Christianity Becomes Esoteric
38:00 Paul’s Example: Meeting People Where They Are
41:00 Harry Potter and the Real Lessons About Prejudice
45:00 Jezebel Spirit and Misused Bible Terms
50:00 The Cost of Poor Communication
53:00 Dehumanizing the “Outsiders”
56:00 Conclusion and Reflections
______________________
Weaponized Religion: From Christian Identity to the NAR:
Paperback: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1735160962
Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DCGGZX3K
______________________
– Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham
– Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ
– Visit the website: https://william-branham.org
– Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg
– Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham
– Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr
– Buy the books: https://william-branham.org/site/books
Category
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LearningTranscript
00:31Hello, and welcome to another episode of the William Branham Historical Research Podcast.
00:36I'm your host, John Collins, the author and founder of William Branham Historical Research
00:41at william-branham.org, and with me I have my co-host and friend, Christian Thomason,
00:47host of Saintem Artifact on YouTube.
00:50Christian, it's good to be back and to talk about culture shock.
00:54You and I were chatting a little bit beforehand, and I was struggling not to laugh,
01:00because I remember this culture shock that we're about to talk about.
01:03We talked previously about language, and we talked about music, and somewhat we talked
01:09about culture, but in the cults we had loaded language, and it was a language that only
01:16we knew.
01:17And often, if you're in a group of people who weren't in your particular movement, they had
01:23no idea what you were talking about, and it was funny.
01:27And even, so we're in, I came out of the Branham sect, we were in a Pentecostal-type religion,
01:32but I could be, I had the experience actually a couple times of being in a room with other
01:38Pentecostal people, and our language just made this communication barrier.
01:43They had no idea what we were talking about in some circumstances.
01:46And we also had very insulting language that I look back, and I think this was not a Christian
01:54way to talk.
01:54This was, if you take the position that many take that cuss words are evil, what we said
02:01was so far beyond worse than a cuss word to a person.
02:04We had, I don't know if you knew this or not, but we would call people who weren't in our
02:10movement, cannon fodder.
02:12And what this means, basically, is during the war, you had, back during the olden days
02:19when they had cannons and muskets, you would send this initial round of troops forward because
02:25the enemy would fire their cannons and just obliterate whoever was sent first, and those
02:30people didn't matter.
02:31It was the second round that came through to win the war.
02:34So the first round of people literally were lives that don't matter.
02:37We don't care about you.
02:39Go in and die.
02:40You're the cannon fodder.
02:41We don't care.
02:42That is how we called other Christians who weren't in the movement.
02:46What a nice way to describe your fellow Christians.
02:49It really makes you want to join the movement, doesn't it?
02:52So anyway, this language thing, I know we talked about language before, but the culture shock
02:58of language, and not just that, but even, so after I've left this, I've been part of
03:05different churches, different organizations, denominations.
03:08And even within those, they have their own language, so that when you're in a crowd
03:13of people who aren't Christian, you're talking one language, they're talking another, they
03:18don't understand what you're saying.
03:19And I look back and I think, you know, some of the conversations that we've had, we could
03:25have really appealed to those who are outside of the Christian community if we just simply
03:29spoke the same language.
03:31Yeah, we talked about it in the very first, in our very first interaction, our very first
03:38video, because I see this becoming a problem in the future.
03:43It's already developing and becoming a huge problem here in Germany, because there's a huge
03:49difference between the languages of each denomination they are using to describe their faith, their
03:59works, their righteous deeds, their moralistic behavior, what being a good person means, what
04:07experiencing God means.
04:09Yeah, they're using exalted or special language, like, it's not even something special.
04:16If you are in a working environment, there's a special terminology to that environment, because
04:24people need it to describe steel, how to work with steel, how to work with computers, how
04:31to work with plastics.
04:32That's totally normal.
04:34So, there is a Christian language already, derived from the Bible, derived from Christian
04:41education, derived from Christian academic discourse, I would say.
04:46I'm not talking ivory tower language, I'm talking serious Christian language, to be as precise
04:53as possible, to be as nuanced as possible, and to be as honest as possible describing your
05:01faith.
05:01That should be a normal thing, but it isn't.
05:04And that's becoming a huge problem for me.
05:07Just today, I had a discussion, and that's the, like, the kicker for me, wishing myself,
05:14boy, I have to talk about this.
05:16It's unbelievable to me.
05:18Over and over again, I am in dialogue with Christians that are using the most exalted language
05:26to describe basic things, or they are thinking that using terms like, I'm a born-again Christian,
05:34I'm part of the body of Christ, connected to all the Christians in the world.
05:39I'm not exaggerating.
05:40That's the language these people are using.
05:42And they really think they are making an argument, an intrinsic, inherent argument that has a
05:50value, but it hasn't.
05:52Saying you're the Wizard of Oz isn't an argument.
05:56Saying you're the Red Power Ranger and have the power of Greyskull isn't an argument.
06:00If you talk like that to a non-Christian from outside of the Christian world, they would think you are
06:07crazy
06:07if you are using this kind of language.
06:09So, you are using this kind of language to make yourself seem like you're professional,
06:17like you're moralistic, but there is no intrinsic argument to it.
06:22It's just framing.
06:23It's just qualifying.
06:25I am an academic.
06:27Okay, so what you're saying is, I am an academic.
06:31Yeah, but what do you want to say?
06:32I am born again.
06:34So, that's the problem we are having.
06:36Christians are talking like that without the understanding of how to describe their faith,
06:44how to describe their beliefs, how to describe their worldview without using this kind of hyperbolic,
06:53exalted language that has no intrinsic value.
06:58Please, don't use it.
07:01Absolutely.
07:02You know, I was in a conversation recently in a group of people with one person who was,
07:08I guess, charismatic Christian, another person who I don't think they were even Christian
07:13at all, and me who has experienced all of this weird mess that I have experienced.
07:18Well, the lady had just gone through some severe trauma.
07:21I won't describe what it is she went through, but she said something to the effect that I
07:28was in a season of whatever was the trauma.
07:32And I looked at the person who's not a Christian, and they're scratching their heads, season?
07:36Is she some kind of a tree?
07:40What kind of a season is she talking about?
07:43In the message, in the Branham cult, we didn't have that language.
07:48So, for me, it's kind of funny.
07:50This goes back to our music conversation that we had.
07:53The first thought to come into my head is the bird song, to everything, turn, turn, turn.
07:59That's what came into me.
08:01And that probably is the more biblical meaning of what she was saying.
08:07However, her interpretation came from loaded language that she was literally parroting her
08:11pastor.
08:12You're in this thing.
08:13You're going through this trauma.
08:15It's for a season.
08:16Have faith, and you will be brought out of this thing because your faith will help you
08:21out of it, which is good.
08:22That's not that bad.
08:24But if you're in these charismatic-type movements, what if you have a dehabilitating disease that
08:31is going to last the rest of your life?
08:33This is not a season.
08:34This is something you must endure.
08:36They don't have allowance for this.
08:38So, her language of season, to her, meant she was going to faith her way out of it.
08:42To me, meant the birds is one of the greatest songs ever, turn, turn, turn.
08:47And to this person who doesn't understand the language thinks, this woman is a tree.
08:51What is she talking about?
08:54And it all comes down to this.
08:56There's two things going on.
08:58Number one, when people are in these movements, they get so caught up in it that even their language
09:03begins to shift and change, and they start parroting what they hear from the minister.
09:09And they don't really – the other thing, the other big thing, they don't consider
09:14their audience when they're speaking.
09:17So, yes, you can have a language.
09:19But if somebody's in your audience who doesn't understand your language – for example,
09:24if I speak English and there's a person who doesn't speak English in my audience,
09:28they can't understand what I'm saying.
09:29They have no idea what I'm saying.
09:31Well, we are – in these Christian movements, especially in the charismatic movements, when
09:37they have loaded language, this turns into a huge problem because now you can even have
09:43– I've seen the case where charismatic Christian from one group is talking to charismatic Christian
09:48from another group.
09:49Their language comes from their pastor.
09:51Their pastor has different loaded language.
09:53Well, now two worlds have collided, and they can't really speak to each other.
09:58And it becomes two towers of Babel.
10:01Yeah, good example.
10:04What you were describing is some kind of private talk.
10:09So, there's a Christian sister.
10:12She is not well-read.
10:13She's not well-educated.
10:15And if she starts to describe her feelings, her well-being in pictures or loaded language,
10:24still, everybody understands what she wants to express, right?
10:33But if you do this in a bigger setting, on a stage, presenting yourself as the big teacher
10:41using this kind of language, that's very deceptive.
10:44At least it's not professional, but you could also say it's deceptive, intentional deceptive.
10:52If you use language that's open for interpretation, right?
10:57Even more than deceptive.
10:58So, I've been in – what's a good example?
11:01In technology, I have a client who has a thing that they are specialized in, whatever it is.
11:08Yeah.
11:08And they have language that they have evolved and created within their organization
11:13to talk about specific business processes related to their organization.
11:18So, this becomes common language within the organization, and whenever the term is used,
11:24people understand that this term refers to this entire policy, operation, function, whatever
11:30it is, right?
11:31But then when they hold a meeting that involves another company, and the other company comes
11:37in, if the employees start using this specific language that only they have and only they know,
11:45and that they realize and recognize that only they have and only they know, it becomes almost
11:51as if they – the outsiders are inferior.
11:55We know this process, we're using this language, and we're not going to even give you the benefit
12:00of telling you what it is we're talking about.
12:02We're just going to continue using our verbiage and leave you in the dark so you can't understand
12:07our speech.
12:09And if you're in a meeting like this, this meeting doesn't go well.
12:12I've actually been in meetings like this.
12:15When you're in a good, healthy meeting, where both sides are collaborating, both sides are
12:20learning, when a term is used, they will pause and say, now we just said this, this is referring
12:26to our process, which includes X, Y, and Z.
12:30So, it's more to the fact of being courteous to the other side.
12:34Yeah, good point.
12:35So, that's anti-Christian already.
12:38So, if you're not interested in the other person that doesn't speak your language, if
12:43you don't ask questions to specify, did you understand what I just mentioned, stuff like
12:51that, that's anti-Christian.
12:52It's not Christian to use language that people can't understand.
12:56That's anti-Christian.
12:58That's like, yeah, these people are not worth it.
13:04On the other hand, what I'm experiencing is, if we are using this kind of language, maybe
13:12in an environment that is common to this language, if we use it over and over again, describing
13:20basic things of life in this exalted, huge, hyperbolic language, we are de-evaluating our
13:29own language, our own culture, and in the end, there's nothing left we can say, if we
13:35want to precise.
13:36I don't know if there's the story of Peter and the wolf in, yeah, like the kid that's
13:43always shouting wolf, wolf, wolf, to a point where his wolf doesn't have any meaning to it.
13:50There's no way to it.
13:51Nobody reacts.
13:52It's worthless, him shouting wolf, wolf.
13:55And the same is happening to our language.
13:58So, we have to be very careful about our culture, about our language, about our outward behavior,
14:07especially in front of the world, if we are explaining us to the world, describing the
14:13gospel to the world, giving a picture of God and all his holy attributes in this language
14:21that we are using.
14:23We are far too careless.
14:27On the one hand, in using words that are too loaded, as you explained, on the other
14:35hand, we are de-evaluating our own culture and language.
14:41There's a balance to it.
14:44There is, and, you know, some of the language, and I'll give some examples here for people
14:50who aren't familiar with this concept that we're talking about.
14:53Some of the examples of the loaded language have the full intention of keeping the people
15:00in a cult-like mindset.
15:03And what I mean by that is, there are specific terms that are used, that are, have the full
15:10intention of corralling the people that include a full doctrine or a series of doctrines that
15:17they claim come from the Bible.
15:19Touch not God's anointed.
15:21So, if you're in a room of people, and there's some person who's…
15:25The Sean Feucht method.
15:27Yeah.
15:27Well, and it was the Branham method, too.
15:29But if you were in a group of people, and somebody who's not a Christian, or even somebody
15:34who is a Christian but has never came in contact with this, they are behaving like a normal
15:41human with curiosity and questions.
15:44And then suddenly the person says, no, touch not God's anointed.
15:47Well, that means to the charismatic Christian, shut up.
15:51You can't talk about the leader.
15:53You can't question the leader.
15:54He has authority, and you must submit to him like you would obey a king or a monarch.
15:59That's the loaded language, right?
16:02But the person who's outside has no idea.
16:05And yet, at the same time, it is used as a condemning mechanism so that the person saying
16:12it can condemn the person who is hearing it, even if they don't understand what it means.
16:18Yeah, yeah.
16:19The opposite of this is spiritual covering.
16:21So, a person goes and does something really stupid and gets injured.
16:26I don't know what it is.
16:28And they're in a group of people in the hospital, and they're in the waiting room, in the emergency
16:33room, and somebody says, I'm under the spiritual covering.
16:38Well, in the context of an emergency room and the context of spiritual covering, I am under the leadership of
16:45a person who claims that he can divinely heal me.
16:49So, therefore, it's okay that I'm in the emergency room.
16:52That would be the weird context of this.
16:54But to the other people in the waiting room, they're like, how does spiritual covering apply to your broken leg?
17:00This doesn't make any sense to me.
17:02And there are several terms like this that spirit of rebellion.
17:07So, if you ask questions, if you're genuinely filled with questions about the movement because you're interested in joining it,
17:16asking those questions, in many cases, will lead you to a convert of the movement who says, you can't ask
17:22these questions.
17:23You have a spirit of rebellion.
17:24Well, then they're just going to walk away.
17:26You're never going to gain this new convert.
17:28So, these words and these phrases, while they have an entire doctrine or series of doctrines behind them, often they're
17:39used as offensive terminology to offend the person you're saying them to.
17:44Look where we are as Christians.
17:48This is exactly what I meant when I was saying, I'm the Red Ranger.
17:52I have the power of Grayskull.
17:55How devout are people, excuse me, how stupid are people to fall for that kind of language, for that kind
18:04of behavior.
18:05But that shows that nuance, precise use of language is so important.
18:15And here I am already struggling.
18:19Every time we both are talking, I am struggling, thinking, oh, my God, that was way too general.
18:26My expression was way too general.
18:27Okay, it was funny, but it was general.
18:30And in this generalistic sense, it was funny.
18:33Oh, my God.
18:34But I was missing some nuance there.
18:36We have Christian brothers and sisters out there with various YouTube channels.
18:42And it doesn't, let's not talk about their agenda or their worldview.
18:46I won't name names, but there are Christians out there struggling with every word on their channel because they know
18:55how important words are,
18:58how important it is to describe some things very nuanced, very precise, very respectful.
19:08This should be everyone's approach to the Christian message, everyone's approach to the Christian message.
19:18It's not a problem if you can't, if you're not that well-read, if you're not that well-educated.
19:24Yeah, okay, then you shouldn't become a preacher.
19:27But that's not a problem.
19:29What we are talking is people presenting themselves out there on a stage using this kind of exhorted language.
19:36People out there in the comments section of any random YouTube video telling others what to believe, what to know,
19:44what to read, lifting themselves up with their rhetoric, putting other people down with their rhetoric.
19:53They are not saying, I'm up here, you are down there.
19:57But that's the rhetoric they are using that makes you feel like you are less of a person than them.
20:03They have the power, you have no power.
20:06They have the Holy Spirit, you don't have the Holy Spirit.
20:09Please, watch their language.
20:11Watch your own language.
20:13It's so important.
20:15It is important.
20:16And there's so many, like I could go off into a tangent talking about examples of what you just said.
20:22But they create these barriers that are just really offensive.
20:27If you're not in the movement, if you're not into the collective movement, they just, number one, they don't make
20:34sense if you're outside.
20:35But number two, they're really offensive.
20:37An example would be faith versus doubt.
20:40A person might say, if you question this, you're in doubt.
20:44What these movements have trained people to do is make everything really black or white.
20:50You're either a believer, you're either in faith, or you're in doubt.
20:53And what this does, this belittles anybody who might have questions.
20:58If you have questions, you are doubting.
21:01But that's not the case.
21:03It's not that black or white.
21:04To form an opinion, people have questions, inward questions.
21:09And that's how opinions are formed.
21:11The very first thing, or isn't that the most important thing that we want to infuse our children with?
21:20Be out there.
21:21Ask questions.
21:22That's the most important skill that you can ever develop in your life.
21:26Ask questions.
21:28Ask everything.
21:34I can't describe it in English.
21:36But basically, Aya, take everything into question.
21:41Everything.
21:42Really, everything.
21:43That's the most important skill you can ever develop in your life.
21:46Ask questions.
21:48Absolutely.
21:49Another example.
21:51We're spirit-filled, but they're religious.
21:54The loaded language behind that is so offensive.
21:57What it means, basically, is we, in this collective group, we have the Holy Spirit, but all other Christians who
22:05aren't in the spirit-filled unity that we're in, they're in a dead religion.
22:10Their religion is dead.
22:12Basically, they're Christians, but they're lesser Christians.
22:15And that is one of the – we had different phrases for this, but essentially that comes down to the
22:21same verbiage as the cannon fodder that I mentioned earlier.
22:24It takes the person who's not in the same agreement with your doctrines that you have, and it puts their
22:35opinion on your doctrines as though their opinion is no longer Christian.
22:40And you're, in essence, taking all other Christians and you're saying they're just – they're not spirit-filled.
22:46They're religious.
22:47They're making a joyful noise unto the Lord, but their noise God is not listening to.
22:53Yeah.
22:54As you mentioned, there's one aspect is they are raising barriers to normal – quote marks, yeah – normal Christians.
23:05So they are – if we say there's one – someone on the stage using this in a deceptive way,
23:13this kind of language intentionally in a deceptive way,
23:17then they are describing things that are so huge, so big, so otherworldly, that there is – that normal Christians
23:29can't find them in their own life.
23:31So they start questioning themselves, questioning their own beliefs, like, he has all this experience, he's seeing all this thing,
23:40describing all the things, I don't have that in my life, maybe I'm not Christian enough.
23:46So there's – they are raising barriers between themselves and God.
23:52The other problem is, of course, the misleading difference between religious and spiritual persons.
24:00And that's exactly what I was experiencing today, because the person I was talking to was framing everything in the
24:10most pious and moralistic words you can find.
24:14Qualifying themselves before they would make any intrinsic argument, permanently, repeatedly, qualifying themselves as moralistic, superior, pious, you name it.
24:31And it's – it's – yeah, it's just – I don't know the word – Selbstbeweihräucherung, we call that in
24:42Germany, like when you're – ah, anointing yourself.
24:48You're permanently anointing yourself.
24:51Yeah.
24:52And that leads me to the other thing that I've noticed.
24:56And this is odd.
24:57I would have expected to see this more in the Branham religions, because they're more cultish.
25:03But I actually see this more on the charismatic side.
25:05So the ones that are not as destructive as the Branham cult, I'm seeing this one.
25:11But when two people get together, if they get into an argument, and one side starts to feel like they're
25:18losing the argument,
25:20then if they're in a charismatic – if they're in a charismatic church, the person losing the argument will say,
25:26well, I don't care what you say, God told me.
25:29Well, that halts all conversation, because if God is the one speaking through them, God can't be wrong.
25:36I must be wrong.
25:37I must be quiet.
25:38I must listen to what they say.
25:40And it halts an argument.
25:41And you really have to ask the question, did God really speak to them, or are they just trying to
25:46make the other person shut up?
25:48And I have to believe that in some of the cases that I have heard, it was literally just to
25:53quiet the other side.
25:55Yeah.
25:56That's what we call in the rhetoric field the argument from power or the argument from authority.
26:05So, if you're somewhat educated, you wouldn't fall for that.
26:10But that doesn't count for most of the Christians out there, even more for Christians that are starting their journey.
26:19They are impressed by that kind of language.
26:23They are impressed by that kind of outward behavior, this habitus, we would call it in Germany.
26:35People presenting themselves with that kind of authority might be impressive for very young, very unexperienced Christians, but in the
26:45serious theological and philosophical arena, you would be a clown.
26:50The problem is that arena is very small, and most of that people don't care about themselves posting in the
26:59comment sections of YouTube or making big video.
27:03videos on YouTube.
27:05And that's why it's so important to have these kind of conversations like you and I have.
27:10It's so important.
27:12We need that.
27:12I just was made aware of that.
27:17Because of our conversations, I became aware of the fact that there's nothing like this in Germany.
27:26It's really missing.
27:27People are craving for it already.
27:30Some of them reached out to me like, man, I felt so alone with all of that.
27:35I was feeling like I'm the only person ever experiencing this kind of deception from the NIR, charismania, call it
27:47whatever.
27:47People are starving for honest, well-meaning, down-to-earth conversations.
27:56Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of modern Pentecostalism transitioned through the latter
28:04reign, charismatic, and other fringe movements into the new apostolic reformation?
28:09You can learn this and more on William Branham Historical Research's website, william-branham.org.
28:17On the books page of the website, you can find the compiled research of John Collins, Charles Paisley, Stephen Montgomery,
28:25John McKinnon, and others, with links to the paper, audio, and digital versions of each book.
28:31You can also find resources and documentation on various people and topics related to those movements.
28:37If you want to contribute to the cause, you can support the podcast by clicking the Contribute button at the
28:43top.
28:44And as always, be sure to like and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or
28:50watching.
28:50On behalf of William Branham Historical Research, we want to thank you for your support.
28:55Whenever I was making my transition out of the cult and into the churches, the thing that really bothered me
29:03is I recognized the loaded language because the moment I started attending new churches, I could use phrases that we
29:11would say after service in the Branham cult, and they had no idea what I was talking about.
29:16Even though we're kind of talking the same language, the language barrier was harmful.
29:22But then after attending one of the new churches for a period of time, if I attended a different denomination,
29:28like you said, each denomination sort of has their own language.
29:32And a lot of that, again, is tailored to the pastor.
29:36The people will hear it over and over and over.
29:39And it's human nature.
29:41You start to pick things up from other people.
29:43In fact, I won't mention names, but some of the podcast hosts that join me, I've noticed them starting to
29:51use phrases that I use just because they're in conversation with me.
29:55And that phrase resonates with them, right?
29:58So that part of human nature is normal.
30:01What's not normal is if a person were to pick up a phrase that I use for whatever reason, and
30:09we're in conversation, and that makes sense, and we can collaborate on our conversation with it.
30:14But if they were to start having a conversation with another person and use the same phrase and watch the
30:21person's expression change and pick up on the fact that they didn't understand what I just said, they would have
30:28halted and used a different phrase that the other person could understand.
30:32But when you are in a religious setting, in a religious context, the people not only pick up on the
30:40language, but they pick up on any hint of pride that the minister has.
30:45If the minister is a very prideful person and the minister is saying these phrases that he has in his
30:54loaded language, the people pick up on that and associate with the pride, then they, too, mimic the pride to
31:01other people.
31:02And you can read through the New Testament.
31:05You can find all of the examples where Paul is preaching in his letters against pride as this is one
31:11of the greatest sins, because if you're prideful, how can you attract other people to Christianity?
31:17Yet when you're picking up the language and you're using it in a prideful way where people can't understand it
31:23and not sensitive to the fact that they don't understand it, what you're doing, it goes beyond just a failure
31:30to communicate.
31:31It's really a breakdown in conversion.
31:35How are you going to convert somebody to Christ if you can't even speak a language that they understand?
31:41Yeah, just in our last talk, I think we ended up talking about Paul's speech at the Areopark.
31:51And from there, we developed a contrast in or talked about how important it is to see your audience as
32:04they are.
32:05If Paul was preaching to Jews, he would start with the history of Israel.
32:09If he was preaching to Gentiles, if he was preaching to Gentiles, of course, he wouldn't start with the story
32:18of Israel.
32:19They wouldn't care.
32:20There was no connection to it.
32:22He would start with God, the creator of the universe, the creator of the world, the creator of the human
32:30race.
32:30The human race stood based on one blood from two parents, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
32:38So, of course, he would recognize his audience.
32:42He wouldn't make his preaching about himself in that kind of way, but he would care about the people he
32:48was preaching to.
32:52Yeah, and the other thing you mentioned, the language barrier, if I was to wrap up my 10 to 15
33:01years experience in Christianity, the topic of language would be in my top three.
33:10Especially because I see the problem that the difference in language between the denominations, especially between, I'm sorry, Charismania and
33:22every other denomination is so different that there is no more common ground.
33:30And I will explain what I mean by that.
33:36Over the years, I talked to many charismatics in a loving, caring way, both engaging, friendly, everything was okay.
33:48But as I grew up or matured in my Christian faith, I read the Bible, I read Christian books, I
33:59was Christian educated.
34:00I became firm with academic discourse and the language used there.
34:06Again, I'm not talking ivory tower language.
34:10I'm talking basic Christian language derived from the Bible.
34:15Okay.
34:16So, over the time, I realized that charismatics aren't using that language anymore.
34:23They have developed some kind of, in Germany, we call it Kiki-Sprache, like baby speech, softening everything up.
34:32The problem in the end and the problem that I see for the future of Christianity is that we, Christians
34:41like you and I, become the strangers, become the strange ones, the harsh ones, the unloving ones.
34:49But we are using basic, common Christian language to be as precise, as nuanced, and as honest as possible.
34:57The problem is not.
34:58The problem is, they are using language that is worldly, esoteric, hyperbolic, and very interchangeable in all of its compositions.
35:10That's a huge problem.
35:12We can't reach them anymore.
35:14The language barrier grows higher and higher.
35:19And there's so much explaining to do.
35:22And just to make sure, I'm not talking about the Holy Spirit touching someone to be in the presence of
35:31God.
35:32I'm talking about truth here.
35:36I'm talking about worldviews here.
35:39I'm talking about the Bible itself.
35:43There are already German translations of the Bible that are outrageous.
35:51We even have a gossip language Bible, a transgender Bible.
35:59And the language there is not a Christian language anymore.
36:03It's a worldly, obscene language that has nothing to do with Christianity.
36:10And I see that, I am sorry, with Charismania.
36:15They are drifting further and further apart from the truth because they can't express the truth anymore.
36:24In its basic, precise, honest form.
36:28Because they don't have the language for it anymore.
36:32They are using Kiki-Sprache, Baby-Sprache, esoteric, hyperbolistic language that is of no use.
36:39That is interchangeable and worthless in itself.
36:44You know, and a lot of it really comes down to not just the language,
36:48but the false worldview that emanates from the doctrine surrounding the language.
36:54Yeah, of course.
36:55It's a world of angels and demons.
36:57And it's either right or wrong, black or white.
36:59That's really how the cults, that's the cultish mentality, a black or white mentality.
37:05Picture, if you will, a minister in the charismatic movement who goes to a college of people who are studying,
37:15I don't know, say they're studying literature, and he's speaking to an audience that is not Christian.
37:22Picture a charismatic minister doing this and quoting Harry Potter in his speech to them.
37:30Every charismatic person in a charismatic church would roll over and say,
37:35this is heresy.
37:37You can't do this.
37:38You can't speak Harry Potter.
37:40But yet, Paul, there's a famous verse, what is it?
37:45I think it's 1 Corinthians.
37:46He says,
37:47To the Jews, I become a Jew.
37:48To those outside the law, I become as one of the law.
37:51I have become all things to all people so that he could save people.
37:55That's a quote from the Apostle Paul.
37:58And he did this, as you mentioned,
38:01not only with the example you gave, but even in his linguistic style, in his letters.
38:08There are letters, and it might have been from that passage.
38:13He says,
38:14For, how is it?
38:16For in him we live and move and have our being.
38:19And that phrase actually comes from a pagan poet.
38:24It's not actually something that he came up with originally.
38:28He also said, what is it?
38:32One of the other quotes is,
38:33We are his offspring.
38:35I think that's from Aretas.
38:36He uses verbiage and language that was familiar to the people who he's writing or speaking to.
38:44And that language may not have came from a Christian circle or Judaism or anything like this.
38:51He's speaking in common terms that they can understand.
38:54And in today's world, especially in the charismatic movement, you can't do this.
39:00I cannot picture a sermon.
39:02I'm laughing as I'm giving these examples because I can't think of a sermon where a minister will speak in
39:08the language of those who are in his audience
39:11if his audience is not the collective church that he's usually speaking to.
39:16I have been in situations where the minister has invited people from outside or he's out speaking at an event.
39:24And the loaded language that's used comes straight from the Bible.
39:27It's not taking into account the audience that's being spoken to.
39:31And he's not following Paul's example.
39:34Paul's example is find common ground.
39:36Show them how the common ground matches what you're trying to say.
39:39Then give them the message and they better understand that message.
39:43Yeah, good example.
39:45One thing I want to mention, J.K. Rowling is so often misunderstood.
39:51We should be glad that she was writing her books for an audience, for an especially young audience, because, and
40:02that's the main point,
40:03she would introduce the horrors of German Nationalsozialismus to a young audience.
40:13That's the essence of her books.
40:18She is describing how people are bullying other people that are different from them.
40:25And later on, as the story develops, the story develops around all the, let's say, I'm sorry for my basic
40:36English,
40:37all the magic people against the Muggles, the lower Muggles.
40:43They hate them.
40:44They want to erase them because they are different.
40:48She is introducing a young audience to an emotional rollercoaster drive of what it means, what German Nationalsozialismus really means,
41:04being a Nazi really means.
41:06That's what her books are about.
41:07And if you want to criticize her for using magic as a kind of device, it's a literary device in
41:19the end, yeah?
41:20Just, it's interchangeable.
41:24But let her story, let her tell a story of what it means to, yeah, to, I hate that I
41:35don't have the language, to, yeah, really marginalize people that are different in your society.
41:43You have just put into words what I have tried to put into words with Harry Potter now for, I
41:48can't tell you how many different episodes.
41:50You hit the nail right on the head because if you are outside of these movements and you are familiar
41:57with the literature, but not just the literature, the meanings within the literature and the literary styles like you mentioned.
42:07If you're outside of the charismatic Pentecostal circles and you're watching one in those circles condemn you for reading these
42:15books, but you have a deep understanding of these books, you take a step back and you just kind of
42:21laugh.
42:21Because while they're falsely accusing you of all of this demonology just simply for reading the book, many of the
42:31things that is mentioned from the magical standpoint, from the demoralizing standpoint, from dehumanizing the moguls like you mentioned, many
42:41of these things are actually happening in real time in these charismatic Pentecostal circles.
42:47So the person who's reading it, they're thinking, wait a minute, you're condemning me and you're practicing this type of
42:53magic, you're demoralizing these people, you're condemning the outsiders as inferior.
42:59How are you not the subject of this book?
43:02Brother, I'm really outspoken right now because I think it's, I don't filter my language, okay?
43:10People that are struggling with a, in my view, really simple Ken Follett novel, right?
43:18People are struggling with a Ken Follett novel, want to explain me what Harry Potter is about?
43:24And these are the same people, their lace art, their way of reading, they are applying the same way of
43:32reading to the Bible.
43:34People, people that are thinking that Harry Potter is about witchcraft, how wrong can you be?
43:40Harry Potter is not about witchcraft, witchcraft is just a literary device, it's interchangeable.
43:47Harry Potter is about marginalizing minorities in a society and how that develops into the horrors we have already seen
43:59all over human history.
44:01It's not about witchcraft.
44:03That's the same, like saying Ken Follett novels are about raping because he's describing, I mean, he's describing most of
44:14his books about medieval history.
44:17So, of course, there's raping, but his books are not about raping, are not glorifying anything medieval, right?
44:26That, it's so stupid, excuse me, it's so stupid.
44:30And the same people that are talking like that, like Harry Potter is about witchcraft, they don't even, they don't
44:36understand a Ken Follett novel.
44:38I'm sorry, people that can't understand a Ken Follett novel can't tell me they know how to read the Bible.
44:44Reading the Bible is about nuance, is about precision, is about honesty, is about truth, is about, is it biblical
44:51or not?
44:52And if you are not that well read, please shut up, stop talking.
44:57That leads me actually to one of the other terms that's used.
45:01There's different variations of this, but they'll say they have a Jezebel spirit or they have a religious spirit.
45:09Ah, yeah, the famous Jezebel spirit.
45:10Yeah, not understanding.
45:13So, the Jezebel spirit, this is one of the things that I studied extensively because this was a phrase that
45:18we use often.
45:19And I was a little surprised when I first began to understand the deeper meaning behind that section in the
45:26Bible.
45:27It wasn't that Jezebel was doing any of the things that they applied Jezebel spirit to.
45:32Jezebel was literally bringing idolatry into Israel, which included human sacrifice.
45:38She did one of the lowest forms of evil that can possibly be done, brought this idolatry that included human
45:45sacrifice.
45:46And she was eventually put to death, right?
45:50Well, they apply this Jezebel spirit even to somebody who might be forming a question in their mind.
45:56You have a Jezebel spirit.
45:57Or especially if you're female and you don't dress according to the dress code, they have a Jezebel spirit.
46:03In Branhamism, it was so ridiculous.
46:06Branham would say that anybody who is female, who wears facial makeup, they have a Jezebel spirit.
46:12Because Jezebel is the only person in the Bible who painted her face, which actually isn't true if you read
46:18the book of Esther.
46:20But that's what he said because he apparently had never read the book of Esther.
46:24But I could go off into a tangent with this like you did.
46:28The terms Jezebel spirit, they apply it to people who might be questioning.
46:34And other examples they might use, they have a spirit of deception.
46:37They have a religious spirit, not a faith-based spirit.
46:42And they apply this to, ironically, to even theologians.
46:47Let's say this theologian, he just has a religious spirit.
46:50And what they're saying is a person who actually studies the deeper meanings of the Bible and understands it like
46:56you do the Harry Potter books, which that puts us on the same page, interestingly.
47:02So, a person who has a deeper understanding of the Bible, we're going to use insulting language against them.
47:08So, therefore, anybody who's in the church who sees this, they suddenly think, oh my gosh, when I read the
47:15Bible, I must read it superficially.
47:17Because if I get the deeper meaning of it, I might catch that Jezebel spirit.
47:22I might become one of these religious zealots.
47:25And so, people actually are not reading the Bible to understand the deeper meanings, they just read it superficially.
47:32And in doing so, you're missing the entire meaning behind each book.
47:37I would understand if we introduced a wording or a deduction, no, a literary device in that form, like Jezebel
47:52spirit in a way to describe, like, make it a common thing to describe someone who is misleading people into
48:00something.
48:01So, we just printed the term, I don't think printing is the right word, but we just printed the term
48:10Jezebel spirit.
48:11Another example would be, a good example would be Calvinism.
48:17If I were to use, if I were to describe to you the foreseeing of God, his almightyness, and so
48:32on, to you, without using the word Calvinism, you would say, yes, yes, that's true.
48:38That's from the Bible.
48:39But if I used the word Calvinism for it, you were just like, oh, no, that's witchcraft, that's, that's bad.
48:47So, there's the problem again, the problem of language.
48:51Sometimes we use deductions to describe things in a very easy way.
48:57Again, your example of a working environment, we are talking computer language, we are talking plastic language, whatever, engineer language.
49:05And we want to, yeah, deduct, I don't know, like, one word describes a whole concept, yeah?
49:19So, we have people like that in Germany as well.
49:22We have words like Heilsgeschichte.
49:25If we talk all the, it doesn't matter, people come to me like, there is no Heilsgeschichte in the Bible.
49:34Of course not.
49:36Trinity is also not in the Bible, but it's a specific terminology we use in theology to describe things without
49:44having the need to explain the entire concept again and again as, again and again as we are speeching.
49:51It's just a specific term.
49:53So, that's a problem of language again, if people don't define their terms correctly, yeah, or demonize certain kinds of
50:04languages without being very well-read, very well-educated in them, and very superficial about it.
50:13Then it's easy to demonize everything into a, that's bad, that's not Christian.
50:18Some of it even goes beyond dehumanizing their verbiage and loaded language that is used for implications of spiritual warfare.
50:28So, this concept of spiritual warfare, which even that in and of itself, if you're speaking to a person who's
50:35not Christian, they won't understand what does this even mean, the spiritual warfare.
50:39But they have brought forth this idea that we're living in a world filled with angels and demons, and if
50:45I stump my toe, it's because a demon was around the corner, but thankfully I had an angel who helped
50:49my toe not to break.
50:50That's the kind of worldview that has been created, and then this idea of spiritual warfare augments it, and they
50:58have a whole set of language that surrounds just the spiritual warfare and the battles you face in it.
51:05So, if you're talking to a person outside of the group, and you say, I just had a breakthrough, well,
51:11the person who's listening who's not part of this movement, they think, oh my gosh, did you invent something?
51:16Are you going to file a new patent with the copyright office?
51:19And it just simply means I have had a spiritual warfare victory, and my victory has helped me not stump
51:27my toe, whatever is the example.
51:29There are words like this, like you said, the word itself has this entire doctrinal meaning that if you were
51:38to take a person who's outside of your group and try to explain what the single word breakthrough meant, it
51:44would take you probably an hour, because you would have to transfer the indoctrination in your head to their head.
51:52And here's where it gets interesting, and this is the most interesting, for me, part of the conversation that we've
51:57had.
51:58The people who are indoctrinated like this, many of them have no desire to be a teacher, are frustrated with
52:05the thoughts of being a teacher, and if they were told that they had to sit and explain the doctrines
52:10of that single word to a person who's not in their movement, they would simply refuse to do so.
52:16I'm not going to teach him.
52:17He can learn for himself.
52:18And so, there's no desire to even teach them the meanings behind the word, yet at the same time, I
52:26don't think many of them could, because they themselves don't even understand what is the doctrines they're supposed to believe.
52:32Yeah, it takes time, it takes care, sometimes it's not even enough to explain a concept, because behind the concept
52:43there's already a worldview.
52:45Like talking Christianity, atheism, new atheism, translating into, we are already at the point where humanists realized that atheism or
53:00humanism can't be a serious argument anymore.
53:08So, we are translating into a post-humanism, so we are translating into a post-humanism or trans-humanism.
53:14So, entire concepts, entire worldviews on the table to explain, just a few words I used need hours to be
53:25explained, fairly nuanced, honest, you name it.
53:30So, what I want to say in the end is, there's a consequence to all of this we just described.
53:39There's a huge consequence to it.
53:42We are devaluing other people if we don't see them as they are, use language they can understand, and that's
53:54not Christian.
53:56If you take it even further, what a great point from you, we are dehumanizing them, they are not from
54:04us, they don't talk the same language.
54:08And because of that, it's so important that we as Christians, the entirety of Christianity, starts to use not only
54:21a common language, biblical language again,
54:23not a traditional language, not a religious language, not the language of your denomination, but biblical language to explain the
54:35gospel and to explain the holiness of God to the world.
54:39And if we don't do that, then we slowly start to dehumanize everyone that's an outsider, and therefore, in the
54:51consequence, we miss to see the image of God in them.
55:00The gospel is not for religious persons, it's not for persons that think of themselves, they don't need God, of
55:08course, of course, the gospel is for them.
55:10But the point I want to make is, the gospel is for the people that don't have the truth, that
55:17don't understand the truth.
55:19For the people outside of Christianity, for them is the gospel, but if we dehumanize them, because they are lower
55:27than us, they don't have the language, they don't have the expressions, they don't have the right clove, etc.
55:37We are dehumanizing them, and therefore, we are missing the point in that all of them are made in the
55:45image of God.
55:46And we are, in effect, treating them like the muggles.
55:50So, thank you so much for doing this.
55:52Exactly, yeah.
55:55Yeah, there's so much more I could get into, and I'm just, I'm really happy that you were able to
56:00put into words what I've been thinking about the Harry Potter books.
56:03Interestingly, I've not read them, I've watched the movies, but the concepts behind it, when you watch the movie and
56:10you understand the deeper meaning, it's just like you said, we should not treat people this way.
56:14They should not have treated people this way.
56:16And if you understand the deeper meaning behind this, it's saying many of the same messages that you will actually
56:23find in the Bible.
56:25It's just using a different verbiage and a language that appeals to a different crowd.
56:29This appeals to a younger crowd of people.
56:31And I sometimes wonder, does not many people in the charismatic movement and Pentecostal movement who have not yet learned
56:40the deeper meanings of the Bible, do not they need something that is lesser and simpler for them to understand
56:47like this?
56:48So, it's written for them.
56:51It's written for them.
56:52Yeah.
56:53It's so ridiculous.
56:55First, J.K. Rowling is attacked nowadays by LGBTQ people.
57:02And that shows that these people never understood the novels and never understood they were written for them.
57:10They are the minorities J.K. Rowling wanted to make a story about.
57:15Like, you are made in the image of God.
57:18You are very, like, you have a worth.
57:22You're a soul.
57:23You're a living being.
57:24You're my human.
57:26You're my fellow human.
57:27That's her message.
57:29These people don't understand it.
57:31And on the other hand, every, it's again like Paul, meeting people where they are.
57:40Every one of these stories, fantasy novels, whatever, introduces some kind of lesser messianic figure.
57:49Being it Superman, being it Spider-Man, being it Harry Potter in the end, saving everyone.
57:58Every one of these stories is about Jesus in the end, because Jesus was the original Messiah.
58:05Every other story than the Bible just tries to explain what a Messiah is, what it means to save people,
58:14what it means to sacrifice yourself for the good of other human beings.
58:20Well, thank you so much for doing this.
58:22Like I said, I could go off for a tangent for hours, and I'm sure you could too, but hopefully
58:28people get the deeper meaning of our conversation.
58:32Well, if you've enjoyed our show and you want more information, you can check us out on the web.
58:36You can find us at william-branum.org and Sanctum Artifact on YouTube.
58:40For more about the dark side of the New Apostolic Reformation, you can read Weaponized Religion from Christian Identity to
58:47the NAR, available on Amazon, Kindle, and Audible.
59:40You can find us at william-branum.org and Sanctum Artifact on YouTube.
59:40For more about the dark side of the New Apostolic Reformation, you can find us at william-branum.org and
59:55Sanctum Artifact on YouTube.
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